FORUM

Please have a look at our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

No permission to create posts
sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Amazing Grace after only two days
Topic Rating: 4.6 Topic Rating: 4.6 Topic Rating: 4.6 Topic Rating: 4.6 Topic Rating: 4.6 Topic Rating: 4.6 (7 votes) 
Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 2:50 am
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

 Aloha everyone,

I decided that I needed to share, instead of just viewing everyone else :D  I've only had my fiddle for 20 days, so don't expect much.  I combined Fiddlerman's and BluegrassDaddy's arrangements and it came out OK, at least for only having played it for two days.  The only issue is that I got really nervous when I knew I was recording.  I put it on Youtube and made it public, which is possibly not a good thing :D  

Watch it here.

I play on working on it a lot more and possibly adding double stops, if I can ever get them down.  Right now, I tend to get double stops when i don't want, and not when I intend. :D  I'm also going to try to work on not getting nervous when I know the camera's on.

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

Avatar
RosinedUp
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 4:34 am
Member Since: September 7, 2012
Forum Posts: 985
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Welcome.  It sounds very good.  Pretty good pitch.  Very good rhythm.  Good dynamics.  You seem to have good "instinct" for it.  I think it's safe to say you've played some other instrument. 

Basically pretty good-looking left hand form. 

You're bowing from the shoulder a little.  That's not one bit unusual for a beginner.  In the bow stroke, the shoulder shouldn't get much use until the frog is closer to the strings.  Gotta get your elbow and fingers involved more, so that the bow stays mostly parallel to the bridge---that's called bowing "straight".

It looks like you're holding the treble side of the fiddle too low, and/or the bass side too high.  A shoulder-rest adjustment or change is probably in order.  Attention to your hold and chin rest and shoulder rest should be ongoing until you're completely comfortable.  If something aches or is too tense, look into it.  You could look for good players on youtube who have a similar body type and try to imitate their hold and their setup.

Two days, man, I think you're off to a great start!

edited 04:38 EDT

Avatar
Uzi
Georgia
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 10:21 am
Member Since: January 19, 2014
Forum Posts: 890
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yea, sounding good.  I hope you're having fun.  Videos are really good for evaluating your form.  For example, notice where the bow comes in contact with the strings as you are bowing.  You'll notice that the contact point ranges from very near the bridge to very near the fingerboard as you move the bow across the strings.  This will change both the tone and the volume of the notes you play. In order to get consistent tone and volume the contact point needs to stay pretty much in the same spot. 

The short answer is to not move the arm from the shoulder, only move it from the forearm to the wrist, while keeping the wrist and the fingers flexible.  Here's some helpful (or at least I thought so) videos on bowing. 

 

Keep it up, you're doing great!

 

 

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. ~Herm Albright

Avatar
RosinedUp
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 11:47 am
Member Since: September 7, 2012
Forum Posts: 985
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Let me revise my remark about your left-hand form.  It's better than pretty good.  It's very good for a beginner.  You have your first finger pulled in tight and square, and your hand is not too close to the nut.  That's very good, because it will allow you to reach as far as you need to reach with the fourth finger.  Um, sorry to say it took me a year and a half to figure that out.  The only things I see wrong on the left are that your wrist tended to bend and your hand moved more than it should have.  But, yeah, generally very good on the left.

Also I should have said there has to be some wrist involvement when drawing the bow, as Uzi said.

What little glimpses I could get of your bow hold looked good, but you might try to include more of your right hand in the video next time.

Fiddle on, @iBud.

Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 11:50 am
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

RosinedUp said

It looks like you're holding the treble side of the fiddle too low, and/or the bass side too high.  A shoulder-rest adjustment or change is probably in order.  Attention to your hold and chin rest and shoulder rest should be ongoing until you're completely comfortable.  If something aches or is too tense, look into it.  You could look for good players on youtube who have a similar body type and try to imitate their hold and their setup.

edited 04:38 EDT

RU, I don't understand what you meant here.  Are you talking about the angle of the fiddle itself with relation to the floor?  I did just receive my Bonmusica shoulder rest on Saturday, so I'm still trying to dial that in.

Thanks also Uzi for your response and the video links.  I've seen both videos, but this will take some time, especially seeing as I have no teacher.  

I actually play better than that, but, and this drives me up the wall, every time I set Photo Booth to record, I clam up and it sounds horrible.  I'm also not used to playing without my practice mute, as I don't want to disturb my wife, but I also noted that my fiddle makes an entirely different sound without the mute, which is welcome.

I'll be working more and more on what y'all said and will likely make another recording in another month so that y'all can check my progress.  My (lack of) progress is a little bit frustrating as I am musically inclined, being a pretty good keyboardist.  I just wish it was as "easy" on the fiddle as it is on my Kronos, but then again, I had five years of structured instruction before I went my own way.  The fiddle is bit more complicated.  

I have one question for y'all.  How do you maintain the same contact point?  I was not aware of just how much my bow jumped around until after I recorded myself.  I do have a mirror handy, but it's too hard to watch the mirror and try to play at the same time.  Of course, if I get too close to the bridge, it gets really scratchy, and playing closer to the finger board serves to diminish the sound, so my desire is to play the 3rd contact point, but I seem to miss it more times than not.

Anyway, thanks again for your constructive comments.  They are welcome and my only request is not to sugar coat them.  Especially now, in my initial foray, I need to have any and all issues rectified, before I get into bad practice habits.

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 1:07 pm
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Agree with both @RosinedUp and @Uzi - absolutely not bad at all on the intonation!  SIGNIFICANTLY better than mine at the same passage of time!  I'm impressed!   Well done!thumbs-upthumbs-up

And yes - your bow seems to have a bit of a "mind of its own" at times.  

I'm going to apologize in advance for what may end up a long-ish post - I'm going to attempt to "talk through" my experiences on bow-control - just the placement, not individual and specific bowing techniques which are quite a different matter....  it may be of interest ( although it may not be "acknowledged and appropriate development/learning technique" - I don't care - it worked for me - LOL ).  Here we go then...

When I started playing, my bow went EVERYWHERE ! LOLOL - I've got it pretty-much under control now - and yes - it does have a lot to do with shoulder movement - and other things.

What I did for practice was this - I don't know if anyone else has done, or seen such a practice - it may not be at all "unique" - but for my own part,  I certainly "discovered it myself" - and for me it helped the "automatic muscle memory" for the right hand, wrist, elbow, shoulder movement (in the sense of "control over it") to some extent - in fact quite a LOT - and how I went about it was like this -

Whenever I planned a practice session, I gave myself at least 30 minutes - for me - no point doing less.  I may be just doing scales, I may have a tune or etude to mess about with - but - first.........

Forget about the fiddle, put it DOWN.  But, hang on to the bow!

Left arm - elbow - draw it right in to your side, make an "O" with first finger and thumb -hold left arm and the "O" vertically and move left fore-arm to about where the bowing position on the strings would be if you were playing ( and tilt the left wrist (and elbow if needed by swinging the left shoulder ) to imagine what the RIGHT hand/bow wants to do - but that's not initially important - imaging bowing horizontally to start with - so the "O" on the left hand will be vertical, and the bow will be moving horizontally - more or less - keep it easy to start with....

Right hand - hold bow upside down (yes, really), place the bow through the "O" in your left hand, let the wood fall into the curve around the base of the thumb

With eyes open - drive the bow back and forth - initially without lifting it - just let the back(wood) of the bow slide in the curve of the "O" on your left hand - and - WATCH where the bow points as you do this and if you

(a) feel the wood riding up the thumb, with the bow pointing backwards - that's bad!   - or

(b) feel the wood of the bow riding up the inside of the first finger, and pointing forwards - also bad!

So.....  when (a) or (b) is happening - as I found it did - "continually correct the path"  with you right hand, wrist and elbow - don't mess with the shoulder - just "be comfortable" with it - until the bow is not "wandering".  Note the word "continually"....  keep at it for a good few minutes...

To correct the path, all the "work" is being done with the RIGHT hand, wrist, elbow, and, ultimately if changing "virtual strings" the right shoulder has to move to a new position - as you work with this exercise and once you're "easy" with it - then the right shoulder will "adapt" - you'll "see how it feels" if you play an "air G" (right shoulder well lifted), it will be different for an air D, an air A and an air E (right shoulder well dropped, and other things dependent, probably bowing almost vertically with the right arm, and the "O" on your left now close to being horizontal)- but for a particular position, all the work will largely (and probably should) come from the wrist and elbow. (That's what I found by experiment)

Keep on doing that until it is absolutely straight and repeatable and doesn't go off and point to, well, Australia,, or the Pole Star, for instance!!!!

Looking back on this "self-taught" exercise - which is only what it is - I can't be exact about how long I spent - but I certainly spent many - maybe 10 to 20 hours in total (over a few months) or so doing this ( oh - play as well - don't limit yourself to THIS! )  - and on each "session", maybe about 3 to 5 mins.

The "ultimate" version of this exercise (for me) is to do this with eyes-closed - AND - also to get used to the "balance" of the bow (although not quite the same as in actual playing, where you of course need down-pressure on the strings ) is to do this exercise with the bow "passing through the 'O' in your left hand" without feeling any part of the bow touch your left thumb or finger....  ( a bit like that game where you have a follow a twisted wire with a hoop and a bell rings if you make contact... )

I appreciate it is not "exact"- the "O" is not exactly where the bowing contact on the real violin will be - and in real playing - you have to adapt slightly - but all I found was that it was the shoulder I had to move - but not in the way you may think - it was just a "one-time" forward or backward motion to re-position the bow, at 90 degrees to the strings- and hold it there - a bit like the left arm just "want to move from the shoulder in order to tilt the elbow and entire fore-arm as you move between strings (to make the final fingering easier without extreme stretching) - it's all a voyage of discovery....

NOW - before you ( or anyone else ) reads too much into this enormous post - I have to say - I am not much more than a 9-month-in player so my words are based ENTIRELY ON my own limited experience. But - I am a very "practical" person and I always try to find "solutions to problems" - and all I can say is - what I have described worked wonders for me in what is but one small part of bow-control and technique.  It is certainly an exercise that worked for me, whether it is a "general thing" or "something that should not to be done for other reasons" - well - I know not.  LOL

Bill

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 1:11 pm
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

iBud said
.....

I have one question for y'all.  How do you maintain the same contact point?  I was not aware of just how much my bow jumped around until after I recorded myself.  I do have a mirror handy, but it's too hard to watch the mirror and try to play at the same time.  Of course, if I get too close to the bridge, it gets really scratchy, and playing closer to the finger board serves to diminish the sound, so my desire is to play the 3rd contact point, but I seem to miss it more times than not.

@iBud - I was putting my above (somewhat long!) post together to describe what I did, as a self-learner to control the bow...  once I posted I saw you asked the question!  LOL -

Look - I'm not much of an experienced player, had no professional tutors, all self-taught - so don;t put too much on what I say - but - I'm pretty happy with it now - I get a "wee bit lost" when I get "out of control" on really fast tunes ( or what are fast for me )...  LOL

EDIT: Actually, although I get quite "detailed" in my posts at times (yeah, words in text messages can be difficult, and oft misunderstood), sometimes pictures (even better, these new moving-pictures we now have) may show it better - if I get a chance, and succeed in recording it well and capturing the movements and positions I was describing, I'll post a video demo of how I got the bow under control ! 

I'm a bit busy and it may take a few days before I can get around to this - but it'll give others an opportunity to criticize / compare / contrast / review etc... against whatever they may have done as beginners, or whatever any/other known techniques are.... )  yup, sounds useful - a vid sounds like a plan..

Cheers,

     Bill

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
coolpinkone
California, the place of my heart
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 1:53 pm
Member Since: January 11, 2012
Forum Posts: 3755
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Wow.. I was not learning that song in the beginning. So very very good job!!!   I am still working on the easy version. 

I think you have a great start on the song.. two days...wow :)

Keep us posted.  I get nervous and I play differently when on camera... also my violin sounds much better in person. :)

Keep it up and congratulations. 

Toni

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

Avatar
RosinedUp
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 2:09 pm
Member Since: September 7, 2012
Forum Posts: 985
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

iBud said

RosinedUp said
It looks like you're holding the treble side of the fiddle too low, and/or the bass side too high.  A shoulder-rest adjustment or change is probably in order.  Attention to your hold and chin rest and shoulder rest should be ongoing until you're completely comfortable.  If something aches or is too tense, look into it.  You could look for good players on youtube who have a similar body type and try to imitate their hold and their setup.

edited 04:38 EDT

RU, I don't understand what you meant here.  Are you talking about the angle of the fiddle itself with relation to the floor?  I did just receive my Bonmusica shoulder rest on Saturday, so I'm still trying to dial that in.

Yes.  I have a shoulder rest like a Bonmusica.  Good choice, IMO.  There are two long screws, one on each clamp, for adjusting the angle in question.  Try screwing the bass-side clamp in a little and/or screwing the treble-size clamp out a little.  It's an optimization problem, because it may make it harder to reach the G-string with your left-hand fingers.  Also notice that screwing both clamps in will lower the scroll, and screwing both clamps out will raise the scroll.  Everybody's anatomy is different, so you have to experiment.

iBud said
I have one question for y'all.  How do you maintain the same contact point?  I was not aware of just how much my bow jumped around until after I recorded myself.  I do have a mirror handy, but it's too hard to watch the mirror and try to play at the same time.  Of course, if I get too close to the bridge, it gets really scratchy, and playing closer to the finger board serves to diminish the sound, so my desire is to play the 3rd contact point, but I seem to miss it more times than not.

Maintaining a nearly-constant sounding point is the main reason that straight bowing is a goal.  And the bow should for the most part move along the line that it's already in, like a flying arrow or a rocket, if you can understand what that means.

Unless you have one of those arrays of three mirrors that you see in clothing stores, the ones that let you see your profile, you are better off if you can feed a video cam into a TV or computer monitor.  That way you can keep your head at your normal playing angle, looking at the screen, instead of having to turn it to look into a single mirror.  If your only cam is built in to a laptop, you can set up a mirror to look at the laptop screen while using the built-in camera.  The latter setup may be better, because then the image won't be reversed.

iBud said
Anyway, thanks again for your constructive comments.  They are welcome and my only request is not to sugar coat them.  Especially now, in my initial foray, I need to have any and all issues rectified, before I get into bad practice habits.

You're welcome.  IMO, that attitude is fundamental to moving forward.

Some hints on intonation: until you get some confidence, check yourself with a tuner to know whether you're hitting the right pitches.   Be sure you have decent strings, so you can hear sympathetic vibrations when you hit notes that resonate with open strings, e.g., D on the G string resonating with open D, and G on the D string resonating with open G.  Search youtube for "tonalization" for more about that.

You're getting a lot of advice.  Revisit the thread as needed to understand and remember it.  If you don't understand, ask.

Fiddle on.

Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 3:12 pm
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

RosinedUp said

Some hints on intonation: until you get some confidence, check yourself with a tuner to know whether you're hitting the right pitches.   Be sure you have decent strings, so you can hear sympathetic vibrations when you hit notes that resonate with open strings, e.g., D on the G string resonating with open D, and G on the D string resonating with open G.  Search youtube for "tonalization" for more about that.

You're getting a lot of advice.  Revisit the thread as needed to understand and remember it.  If you don't understand, ask.

Fiddle on.

Aloha again RU,

Thanks for your hints on intonation.  I know I completely missed the B natural in the last section.  My 1st finger was not quite all the way over and it sounded horrible.  I was going to re-record it, but I'd already recorded lots of takes and I was getting tired, so I apologize for that.  I use Fiddlerman's tuning page to tune my fiddle up before each practice session, but sometimes I just miss the notes.  I'm still trying to get used to knowing exactly where my fingers have to be - something I don't have to do on my Kronos keyboard :D  

Aloha again Toni, 

Thanks for your kind words.  At this time, it's more of an "I'd better get to actually playing this thing or my wife is gonna kill me" kind of thing.  I've always admired the skill of accomplished violin/fiddle players and just want to get to the point of enjoying it as much as I see in their faces.  I have no illusions of ever achieving an exalted position, but want to be able to play in such as way that other people would want to hear me.  I especially like bluegrass/celtic/Cape Breton/Irish stylings, as they tend to be "foot stompin'" music.  Still, if I could even play 1/1000th as well as Hillary Hahn, that would most certainly exceed any ambition of mine.

Aloha MadBill (what a name :D),

Thanks for your suggestion with respect to wild bowing.  Intellectually, I know what is to be done, but physically it's pretty hard to do.  I sometimes have that conundrum while playing my keyboard as well :D  I'm primarily picking on Bach's Inventions and a couple of Beethoven and Mozart pieces, because I've played them before.  Invention No. 8 is especially difficult due to the precision required in both hands.  I just have to knuckle down and use your bowing suggestion and try to concentrate only only using the arm when I bow - just use the shoulder for string crossings.  Thank you again for your well-documented suggestion.  I eagerly await your video :D

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 3:42 pm
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
4

LOL @coolpinkone - heyyy Toni - it gets easier ( being on cam / facing people live ) - I do the Homer Simpson thing....   get a picture in yer mind - I do the "DOH, Duff.  Mhhhh beeeer...." thing...  (and no, I don't picture the audience nekkid as is often suggested LOLOLOL )

I don't see the cam, I don't see the audience - ( well, as yet never had more than a live audience of 5 on fiddle - although played to many more on guitar ) - but when I'm playing, I see nothing - if that makes any sense at all -  and I just do what I do, sometimes make an a55 of myself which is nothing new for me - and sometimes feel/think "man - THAT hit the spot"... LOL  For me, nothing, but nothing beats a "live" performance - after so many years, I'm old enough and ugly enough not to care....  (well, of course I "care" - but you know what I mean )

But,  I guess where I'm coming from is that I'm already used to playing guitar to live audiences over the years so that maybe kinda "dulls" the intensity/adrenaline a bit - but.... hmmmmmm... from the fiddle/violin perspective - sure - I guess we're beginners here, and sure - we're all aware of our own limitations - but - generally - we "like to share where we are".  That's a REALLY GOOD THING, in my opinion, and we should "relax into it" and do the best we can....

So, at both @iBud and @coolpinkone - do not be afraid/conscious of the camera / mic - I know - not easy - but just keep doing it - record even when you're not planning to post but "think in your mind" - this is my final/live take...  LOL - first time round you'll be as nervous as being live - 10, 20 ,30 times later - you'l forget the cam / mic is on...  and make EVERY "take" your best

Relax .....

Play your best...

Be free......

(LOL - wish it was as easy as that - but JUST FORGET THE CAM /MIC is on )

Bill

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 4:16 pm
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

iBud said ...

Aloha MadBill (what a name :D),

  LOLOL - the "Mad" bit relates to my being "mad, irritated and annoyed" at my lack of ability on the devil's own instrument, not to my state of mind ( hopefully) - and if I haven't said so already - welcome to the insanity that is the FM community, not to mention the violin / fiddle, and indeed any such short-stringed and fret-less instrument ( yes we sometimes make jokes about violas - but they are in jest  - mostly - hmmm - actually I feel like bypassing the viola and seeing if I can find a cheap, usable, playable cello )....   "Forever in electric dreams" - OK - maybe before your time folks - extract from some wiki material - and "things about "making a take" LOL - 

Moroder wrote "Together in Electric Dreams" which was to be a male solo vocal, when he asked who Barron would like to sing the lyrics, Barron immediately thought of his former associate Philip Oakey.

When Oakey recorded the song it was over very quickly, after the first full recording Moroder told Oakey that the first take was "good enough, as first time is always best". Oakey who thought he was just rehearsing insisted on doing another take. Moroder let him but to this day Oakey is convinced that Moroder still used the first take on the final production. Originally released to advertise the film, "Together in Electric Dreams" quickly overshadowed the original film and became a hit single in its own right.

Oakey states that it is ironic that a track that took literally ten minutes to record would become a worldwide hit, while some of his Human League material that took over a year to record didn't

oh heck - I HAD to find a short extract - sweet - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5Og0-iuU9c

Bill

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
coolpinkone
California, the place of my heart
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 4:27 pm
Member Since: January 11, 2012
Forum Posts: 3755
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thanks Bill.

I know what you say is true.  I never cared much when I was first beginning. Now peer pressure and stuff are holding me back. 

I can't see me doing much video recording in the future.  (which is weird.. why when I am playing better and better would I want to record less.. ha ha)  

Unless I get that green screen. :) ha ha.. The Eiffel Tower or Castle Leoch (sp) Beckons me. 

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 5:52 pm
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

RosinedUp said
Let me revise my remark about your left-hand form.  It's better than pretty good.  It's very good for a beginner.  You have your first finger pulled in tight and square, and your hand is not too close to the nut.  That's very good, because it will allow you to reach as far as you need to reach with the fourth finger.  Um, sorry to say it took me a year and a half to figure that out.  The only things I see wrong on the left are that your wrist tended to bend and your hand moved more than it should have.  But, yeah, generally very good on the left.

Also I should have said there has to be some wrist involvement when drawing the bow, as Uzi said.

What little glimpses I could get of your bow hold looked good, but you might try to include more of your right hand in the video next time.

Fiddle on, @iBud.

Aloha again RU,

Thanks for your comments on my left hand technique.  I'm actually still somewhat clutching the neck a little bit, but the Bonmusica shoulder rest (I got a FOM shoulder rest with the fiddle) helps out a LOT.  That's why you saw the wrist movement, something I really want to vastly improve.  I watched a ton of videos from Fiddlerman, Red Desert Violin, Professor V, Zlata Brouwer, and others, specifically to see how they use their left hands.  I wanted to see how they positioned their fingers.  I'm going to have to work on the fingerings for melodic minor scales, however, as my 2nd finger naturally wants to line up next to my 3rd finger.  I'm going to have to re-watch them in much more detail to get everything right.  

The bowing thing, thanks for that comment and the videos Uzi, is a work in progress.  I also need to work on the "continuous" bow movement - when the bow gets to the top of an up bow or the bottom of a down bow - so that I can start the opposite movement without a break in the sound.  I saw a video from The Online Piano and Violin Tutor (on YouTube) that goes over the transition from up bow to down bow (and vice versa). One thing she stresses is flexibility in the right hand, another something with which I'm having some trouble.  It seems that the real "learning" process is to get everything working together - the music comes naturally after that :D

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 6:02 pm
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

coolpinkone said
Thanks Bill.

I know what you say is true.  I never cared much when I was first beginning. Now peer pressure and stuff are holding me back. 

I can't see me doing much video recording in the future.  (which is weird.. why when I am playing better and better would I want to record less.. ha ha)  

Unless I get that green screen. :) ha ha.. The Eiffel Tower or Castle Leoch (sp) Beckons me. 

Aloha again Toni,

I agree that the green screen adds a lot more fun, especially if you coordinate your movements with your background (like on a roller coaster :D), but please keep on recording.  Those of us behind you get a lot of positive reinforcement by seeing what you can do, and knowing that with a lot of hard work we can accomplish the same.  i forgot his handle (I keep thinking Fiddlin Struedel, but that's not it), but there's a guy here that plays the same style I want to learn.  He said he's played that style for 11 years, so I keep telling myself that I can do the same, maybe not with the same clarity, intonation, and speed, but I should at least be able to tackle the same music.

Personally, I don't worry about peer pressure.  I don't have a teacher, so all of this is self-taught.  I do have the Suzuki books, so I can somewhat follow the same path, but everyone learns at a different speed and in different ways and I don't want to "compete" with anyone here.  

I look forward to viewing everyone's videos and will reciprocate in kind from time to time.  Of course, i would hope that my playing and technique improves and is evident in the videos, and just maybe could inspire someone else.

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

Avatar
Uzi
Georgia
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 22, 2014 - 11:27 pm
Member Since: January 19, 2014
Forum Posts: 890
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
16sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

@iBud you have the right attitude and that will carry you a long way. With many instruments, I'd be farther along that I am now (after 8 months). However, the fact is that the fiddle is not a very easy instrument to learn, because it requires so many coordinated subtle movements by numerous muscle groups on both sides, combined with an unmarked landing zone for the finger tips. It can be done, it just won't happen for most of us as quickly as we initially hoped. With logs of thoughtful practice and the passage of time, incremental improvements do come. 

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. ~Herm Albright

Avatar
RosinedUp
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
September 23, 2014 - 3:58 am
Member Since: September 7, 2012
Forum Posts: 985
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
17sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

IMO, the best single resource to inform you and keep you away from bad habits is Galamian's Principles of Violin Playing and Teaching.  Hardcopy is $10, but you can download the pdf free from http://archive.org/details/pri.....viol00gala .  Of immediate use are his photographs and descriptions of the fingers of the left hand.

A proper bow hold is fundamental to bowing straight and making smooth directions changes.  The best videos I know are free on youtube, from Beth Blackerby (violinlab bow hold), Pierre (Fiddlerman bow hold), and Kurt Sassmannhaus (violinmasterclass bow grip).  Use the words in parentheses as search terms on youtube.

Avatar
rockinglr33
Members

Regulars
September 23, 2014 - 10:38 am
Member Since: September 21, 2013
Forum Posts: 321
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
18sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

well everyone has given you awesome in-depth answers (Far better then anything i could have helped with) I just wanted to pop over here and say good job! you are tackling stuff light years ahead of me! You are doing awesome for just starting out!

 

And isn't that so annoying when you get the jitters from the camera. its like my subconscious knows its on and refuses to play as good as usual! hahaha. stupid photo booth! 

 

Keep up the awesome work!!!

Lead me, Follow me, or get out of my way!

             ~General George S. Patton

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
September 26, 2014 - 1:59 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11702
19sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thanks for the post iBud. Doing great for such a short time.

I recommend that you draw longer bows to avoid so much silence between your notes. Bowing direction and planning is important to avoid running out.

In case I have repeated someones comments, I haven't read all the posts on this particular thread because I am trying to catch up from over 700 posts. Just got back from a two week vacation.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
iBud
Honolulu, HI
Members

Regulars
September 30, 2014 - 5:08 pm
Member Since: August 28, 2014
Forum Posts: 376
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
20sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Aloha again everyone,

I really appreciate all of the feedback.  @Fiddlerman, the silence between the notes is primarily due to my bowing, but I was also using the built-in microphone of my iMac so, while I increased its sensitivity, the built-in mic is probably not the best one to use in that scenario. :D

I did find a trick last night that helped me out with straighter bowing.  As I played, I made a conscious effort to look at the bow and the fingerboard.  I first took a look in the mirror to ensure proper placement of the bow, then looked at the bow, bridge, and fingerboard.  I used the fingerboard to keep the bow parallel to it, which also served to keep the bow perpendicular to the strings.  I'm still trying to dial in my shoulder rest, so there was a little of movement, but using the bridge, fingerboard, and bow in that manner helped to straighten out my bowing a bit.  I need a lot more practice, but I'm getting a bit better.

Now, I just need to get my left hand used to playing more rapidly.  I tend to think about where my fingers need to go, but once I'm more accustomed to how far they need to travel between notes, I'll sound better.  My intonation, while still not that good, is improving, due in no small part, to the help and advice given on this forum.  I really appreciate everyone here, without whom I may never have actually taken up the violin.  Thank you again, everyone.

Keep-Calm-and-Fiddle-On-small-2.jpg

 

 

 

No permission to create posts
Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 231

Currently Online:
34 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today harvestman, fiddlinmama
Upcoming HeadCheese, Mad_Wed, ButteryStuffs, kit, makinnoise

Top Posters:

coolpinkone: 3755

Mad_Wed: 2849

Barry: 2661

Fiddlestix: 2637

Oliver: 2439

DanielB: 2379

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1

Members: 3555

Moderators: 0

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 16

Forums: 56

Topics: 6441

Posts: 80328

Newest Members:

elaine a, Mukundan, MyMing, dbsimon, stirlingite771, mdedmon

Administrators: Fiddlerman: 11702, KindaScratchy: 1651