FORUM

Please have a look at our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

No permission to create posts
sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Today's practice: Scarborough Fair
Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 (0 votes) 
Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 13, 2012 - 6:20 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I recorded this for two reasons: I wanted to try recording and posting video from my new tablet and I was trying to see what was causing some squealing that I was getting. The former went very well and I think that I mostly solved the latter. I believe it was caused by a wandering bow. There's just a little squealing in this. I figured i might as well post it here and get some feedback. Any suggestions are welcome.

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
Fiddlestix
Michigan, USA
King
Members

Regulars
October 13, 2012 - 7:02 pm
Member Since: January 21, 2012
Forum Posts: 2637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Very nice, Diane.....clap I really didn't hear any squeeling, but if you mean when you touch on a new note, it happen's to me too. What I found the problem is, is that when you change bow direction's and hit a new note at the same time, your timing has to be precise. I mean, when you play a note and go from up bow to down bow, the timing has to be spot on.

At least that's what I found I was doing.  You played that very nicely.

Avatar
myguitarnow
Laguna Beach
Pro advisor
Members

Regulars
October 13, 2012 - 7:46 pm
Member Since: June 15, 2011
Forum Posts: 1094
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Wow Diane you've improved a bunch. I didn't really hear any squealing either. Some scratchy notes kinda ;-) . When I get scratchy notes I noticed that I don't get my right shoulder up or down quick enough to get in the right bow position when moving to different strings. And yep, I get scratchy sounds when my bow starts to wonder too.

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 13, 2012 - 9:36 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks for the feedback and nice comments folks. Here's a short clip from another take where you can hear the squeal. It's on the third note.

feature=youtube_gdata_player

I think you're right, Ken that it has to do with note changes. It seems to mostly happen on the A string, especially the open note on an up bow. I think the angle and/or tilt of the bow has something to do with it.

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
October 13, 2012 - 9:51 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11717

Great job Diane,

One suggestion is that you play a couple slurs that will keep your bow direction in line with phrasing. the first slur is the first E and F tied togeter. Then the pick-up to the next phrase with the A and C.

http://fiddlerman.com/wp-conte.....h-Fair.pdf

Scarborough-Fair-Screenshot.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
DanielB
Regulars

Members
October 13, 2012 - 10:38 pm
Member Since: May 4, 2012
Forum Posts: 2379
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Not claiming to be sure what causes that, but what I usually try when I get it is (in order):

Wipe off the strings

Wipe off the bow hair and re-rosin

Try shifting the point of contact where the bow meets the string slightly towards and away from the bridge when you're getting that sound and see if it goes away.

To just get through the piece I'm playing, I'll usually tilt the bow a little at those places in the melody so I am using the edge just a little more than the flat.  If it happened a lot, even when I was sure the strings and bow didn't have too much rosin, I'd probably get another A string and see if that fixes it.

Do you have more than one bow you can try or do you ever get to play on somebody else's instrument?  That could narrow down if it is something about the instrument/strings/bow or something you are doing.

I couldn't see what your left hand fingers are doing, but are you touching the strings at all at that moment, like fingering the next note?  If you were fingering the next note on the D, and the finger touches the A string even very lightly, there are some particularly unpleasant harmonics you can hit down in that part of the fingerboard. 

"This young wine may have a lot of tannins now, but in 5 or 10 years it is going to be spectacular, despite the fact that right now it tastes like crude oil. You know this is how it is supposed to taste at this stage of development." ~ Itzhak Perlman

Avatar
Picklefish
Merritt Island, Fla
Pro advisor
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 7:55 am
Member Since: June 25, 2012
Forum Posts: 1281
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

considering you cant hardly move your wrist, you have very little windshield wiper effect. It sounded great. as for the squeeks, sometimes you can move the bow too fast with too little pressure and you dont cut into the note well enough. Othertimes, you might not finger the note hard enough to set the vibration. There are several things that can cause this. Unfortunately with your wrist youre probably not applying pressure increases through twisting the wrist towards you. I would try to isolate the specific note that is troublesome and cut into it more with your fingers when you play to really grab that note. Just take care not to emphasize it if its not accented.

its a 1000 piece puzzle that requires exact placement of all its  pieces. You sounded really great by the way.

"Please play some wrong notes, so that we know that you are human" - said to Jascha Heifetz.

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 14, 2012 - 10:54 am
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

More helpful comments, Pierre, Daniel and Rob.

@Pierre: much to my chagrin, you mentioned the slurs. I usually do play them but was so focused on fixing the squealing that I forgot to play them. (Oh, sure, right, you're thinking) :)

@Daniel: I did try wiping off rosin from the strings and bow but it didn't help much.

@Rob: Actually, even though the wrist support limits my flexibility, I seem to get less bouncing with it on, so that might be a clue to that problem. And, talk about windshield wiper effect, just look at this clip, also from yesterday, of me playing Silent Night. My bow is all over the place and, as a result, sounds AWFUL. I'd say turn off the sound but you need to hear it, too, I guess.

I probably should have posted that one first for critiquing, but more or less critiqued myself and fixed some of the problems.

Here goes nothing:

feature=youtube_gdata_player

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
October 14, 2012 - 2:40 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11717

Unfortunately that link did not work for me. dunno

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Fiddlestix
Michigan, USA
King
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 2:44 pm
Member Since: January 21, 2012
Forum Posts: 2637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

I got " Error 502" myself  frown

Avatar
Almandin
Stockholm, Sweden
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 2:52 pm
Member Since: August 22, 2012
Forum Posts: 302
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

You probably need to remove the s in https://. Possibly also the &feature thingee. That's what I did anyways smile

~ Once you've ruled out the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be true. ~

Avatar
coolpinkone
California, the place of my heart
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 4:24 pm
Member Since: January 11, 2012
Forum Posts: 3767
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Wow.... Diane I loved it and I love the tone of your violin!!!!!

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 14, 2012 - 5:05 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thanks, Toni. My violin does have a nice tone when I play it right. :)

Sorry about the bad link, all. Guess posting from my tablet isn't as smooth as I thought it was. The funny thing is when I posted the first video in this thread, it appeared as just a link, not a preview window. Wasn't sure if it was that was a function of posting from a tablet or what. Then I looked at it later and, lo and behold, there was a preview of the video.

Then, I posted the second video, which also appeared as only a link, but that still remains just a link now.

Anyway, I'm on my computer now, so hopefully it will now show as a preview and...work for everyone. Here goes, again:

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
myguitarnow
Laguna Beach
Pro advisor
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 5:15 pm
Member Since: June 15, 2011
Forum Posts: 1094
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

When members post links like Diane's original post you can just right click to open in a new tab or window and it will work.

Avatar
Fiddlestix
Michigan, USA
King
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 8:21 pm
Member Since: January 21, 2012
Forum Posts: 2637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Nice job, Diane... you play that very smooth. clap

I think we are going to need som Christmas icon's up here very soon.

 

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 14, 2012 - 9:45 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
16sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thats nice of you to say, Ken, but I posted that because of how bad it is. duncecap

My bow wanders all over the place, which causes, I think, the scratching and squealing. Plus my intonation is off. I fixed some of that by the time I did Scarborough Fair. Video is great for critiquing your own playing, even if you never share it.
violin-student
BTW, didn't there used to be a Santa smilie?
dunno

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
AdverseD
Regular advisor
Members

Regulars
October 14, 2012 - 9:50 pm
Member Since: June 24, 2012
Forum Posts: 110
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
17sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

For the wandering bow thing, my suggestion is to practice the "Finger Flexibility" exercises a lot even when not playing (Like a pencil or something). It seems to me that your bow is moving in an arc due to no wrist or finger action on the bow hold. It helps me anyway xD good luck.

Avatar
DanielB
Regulars

Members
October 15, 2012 - 6:45 am
Member Since: May 4, 2012
Forum Posts: 2379
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
18sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Well, wrist braces kind of impair that whole "flexible wrist" thing, because that is what they are supposed to do.

I think that once her wrist is feeling a bit better, the bow drifting will cease to be a problem.  It's probably just a temporary thing.

"This young wine may have a lot of tannins now, but in 5 or 10 years it is going to be spectacular, despite the fact that right now it tastes like crude oil. You know this is how it is supposed to taste at this stage of development." ~ Itzhak Perlman

Avatar
Mad_Wed
Russia, Tatarstan rep. Kazan city
Members

Regulars
October 15, 2012 - 5:12 pm
Member Since: October 7, 2011
Forum Posts: 2849
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
19sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Hey, Diane, that was very good!

Maybe someone said it, but i'll say it anyway: great head position improvement!!! It was getting better and sometimes not so good, but now it seems to be pretty cool! I think your neck appreciates it =) Good intonation!!! I still can't play that clean as You!!

thumbs-upthumbs-upthumbs-up

Agreed with PickleFish about the bow preassure and speed, that's exactly what i was thinking about, while watching this vid =) Well not that, but the shorter one =) The first was nice!

Well in the Silent night  i believe it's more related to the bow angle, as well. And the "undesirable" sound have noticeable different nature.

I know it's kinda tricky to play with the brace, but if there's no choice, try to get used to - start with long bow strokes to figure out how to manage it. I understand that feeling - feels like you have to start it all over again with "an alien (zombie) hand", but it will get better. And when You'll take it off  - You'll see much more difference. As for me it was a good trainer thing =)

KEEP UP!!!! cheerleaderYou're doing great!

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
October 15, 2012 - 8:48 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
20sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thanks, Daniel and Naska. The brace you see on my wrist in these videos is a flexible one that I bought for playing the violin. I also have another one that has rigid splints. It's nearly impossible to play with that one on.

As you indicated, Naska, the brace does help my playing in some respects. And now that I've seen what it can do to my bow angle, I'm paying more attention to that and overcoming it, I think. I hope it is a good trainer, as it was for you. The pain seems to be going away, so hopefully I won't need it at all soon.

Thanks for the words of encouragement all!

hats_off

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

No permission to create posts
Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 231

Currently Online: yellowdresses
34 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming Mad_Wed, Prudence, ButteryStuffs, kit, makinnoise

Top Posters:

coolpinkone: 3767

Mad_Wed: 2849

Barry: 2661

Fiddlestix: 2637

Oliver: 2439

DanielB: 2379

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1

Members: 3562

Moderators: 0

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 16

Forums: 56

Topics: 6446

Posts: 80405

Newest Members:

EKBanjo, charlieD, Folky fiddler, Morgenes42, stringo, sexymom04

Administrators: Fiddlerman: 11717, KindaScratchy: 1651