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Can't Keep Tune
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Alveraz20
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May 13, 2012 - 3:56 pm
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I have a violin that for about 3-4 months kept almost perfect tune at all times. I could travel with it and would just have to fine tune it whenever I arrived where I was going. I went somewhere a few weeks ago and it was an outdoor event and the violin was out of tune. The fine tuners weren't enough to get the job done I had to turn the pegs. I got home and once again it was out of tune so bad I had to turn the pegs. While trying to tune it the bridge fell over which had never hapend before. So I reset it and finally got it in tune. All was well until I got to church the next night and it was again out of tune so bad I had to turn the pegs. This time the G string popped out at the bottom so we put it back and then it finally snapped while trying to tune it. I took it to the music store that put the strings on it in Jan. and the guy said that whoever put them on put them on all wrong said the bridge wasn't right for the violin and he wanted to charge me $48 to cut a new bridge. The owner said since I was just a beginner to not worry about the bridge right now and wait until I'm more proficient and then worry about the bridge. He was kind enough however to give me a string for free. So I got it home and put the string on (first time ever) and tuned the violin and it sounded awsome. About five minutes later it was out of tune so bad again that the pegs would have to be tuned. Why would a violin go from being able to keep a tune so well to it can't hold a tune for more than a few minutes. Help please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Oliver
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May 13, 2012 - 4:06 pm
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There is one possibility you must check out right away.  I assume you are going flat. 

Your finger board (violin neck) may be leaning forward(down) as the hide glue holding it is creeping.

Wedge a dowel or other device under the finger board to see wat happens.

Another thing could be that the tail piece plastic sling is slipping ( watch out !)

Then too, it could be something else 

drooling

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

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springer
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May 13, 2012 - 4:23 pm
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First things first. A new string will need to be retuned about every hour or less at first. It will start to stay in tune for longer and longer untill U only need to retune every couple of days. Next YOUR Violin was hard to keep in tune because the bridge was moving (ie it moved so much that it "snaped" out). You need to look at your bridge from the side once in a while to make sure it is not leaning forward. It should lean back a fraction.fish

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Alveraz20
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May 13, 2012 - 4:35 pm
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Thanks everyone..process of elimation the bridge is ok I believe it is the tail piece because after reading the first reply I remembered the tail piece did move after the bridge fell. I'm sorry guys I'm a guitarist turned violinst so I really do not know anything at all I'm self taught (except for what I've learned on this site) so when it comes to the instrument itselt I don't know anything about it.

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springer
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May 13, 2012 - 4:47 pm
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Of course the tailpiece moved the bridge keeps the strings tight and the tailpiece too.

I have had these problems too.hats_off

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dionysia
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May 13, 2012 - 4:50 pm
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Unfortunately, sometimes tuning a violin can be like trying to tie your shoes while running. The most important parts in tuning are all moveable and held together by the tension of the strings.

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Oliver
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May 13, 2012 - 4:53 pm
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Al    ......  I'm assuming that you know how the tail piece sling is attached under the body of the tail piece (threads in there).  Sometimes the threads slip and you see nothing from the outside.  Of course, the loop can also just stretch.

A tailpiece snapping loose is a mess and DANGEROUS also.

 

fish

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

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NoirVelours
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May 13, 2012 - 7:00 pm
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Could it simply be that your pegs got a bit loose with the change in humidity of the outside and you did not push them in when you were retuning it? If the bridge got loose those strings were probably VERY loose because the tension of even just 2 strings is enough to hold the bridge in place without any problem.

I had a warning concerning my pegs about that when I received my violin.

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

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Alveraz20
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May 13, 2012 - 11:21 pm
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I may just have to take it to a shop. Thanks guys I appreciate everything

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Fiddlerman
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May 13, 2012 - 11:24 pm
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Don't worry though. It may feel discouraging now but once the violin is tuned and stabilized, it will not need to be tuned that frequently. You just need to get past these beginning issues and all will be well.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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cdennyb
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May 14, 2012 - 1:27 am
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springer said

... It should lean back a fraction.fish

actually the bridge should be at a 90 degree angle, not leaning either way. That will insure that the feet of the bridge maintain full & maximum contact with the violin body. Leaning either way puts a LOT of un-necessary stress on the edge of the maple wood foot of the bridge and does nothing to enhance the transmission of the frequencies made by the strings, not to mention 'digging into' the body wood surface on an angle.

I think all the suggestions above are accurate, it will just take some effort to find the right reason.

Good luck and keep us posted as to what you find.

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

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Oliver
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May 14, 2012 - 1:03 pm
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In fact, one well known luthier on the internet insists that his "correct" bridge must stand perfectly vertical WITHOUT aid of the strings or anything else during the setup stage.

This makes a great game and I tried for about 40 minutes before I gave up.

dazed

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

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Kevin M.
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May 14, 2012 - 4:23 pm
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Oliver said
In fact, one well known luthier on the internet insists that his "correct" bridge must stand perfectly vertical WITHOUT aid of the strings or anything else during the setup stage.

This makes a great game and I tried for about 40 minutes before I gave up.

dazed

When properly made a bridge does stand on its own and no light is seen under the feet.

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Oliver
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May 14, 2012 - 5:32 pm
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Kevin.

Isn't there a mechanized jig for pulling a bridge over the exact shape of a violin to get a perfect fit ?   I think I saw one (maybe).

I certainly cannot make an ideal fit by hand ?

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

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springer
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May 14, 2012 - 7:57 pm
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Sorry Dennis but you'r wrong the experts say the bridge should lean back not forward not stright up.  Not my opinion.red_cursing

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Oliver
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May 14, 2012 - 8:10 pm
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The bridge leaning (slightly) backwards allows for the bridge to pull straight as it is tuned in the normal course of playing.  So, a few weeks after installation of strings, the bridge should be close to vertical.

This assumes you usually tune (daily?) from a "flat" condition.  If your violin always goes high over nite then I don't have a clue what that is duncecap

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

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KindaScratchy
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May 14, 2012 - 8:55 pm
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OK, regardless of whether forward, back or straight up is the correct position, which way is forward and which way is back? Just curious.

dunno

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

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NoirVelours
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May 14, 2012 - 9:06 pm
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forward is toward the scroll, for me anyway.

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

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cdennyb
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May 14, 2012 - 11:45 pm
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springer said
Sorry Dennis but you'r wrong the experts say the bridge should lean back not forward not stright up.  Not my opinion.red_cursing

could you please provide at least two "experts" opinions on this fact.

 

Here's a few to justify and confirm my statement. I don't volunteer information of such importance without being absolutley correct if at all possible. Use the logic involved and you will agree, and any 'expert' is probably in question as being an expert if they say leaning is better.

 

1- http://www.ehow.com/how_587358.....ridge.html

2- http://christinaksilvestri.wor.....ag/violin/

3- http://www.howtomendit.com/ans.....?id=177573

4- http://www.violinist.com/blog/.....0084/8569/

5- http://www.learninghowtoplayth.....aight.html

6- http://www.vickiviolin.com/07-.....n_Care.htm

7- http://www.fiddlehangout.com/topic/26970

8- http://ezinearticles.com/?How-.....id=6767650

9- http://www.violins.ca/info/tun....._snap.html

10- http://www.violinist.com/discu.....m?ID=22154

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

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NoirVelours
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May 15, 2012 - 9:10 am
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I must agree with Dennis, everything I rad about bridge was 90 degree.

A bridge should always be kept vertical and straight. It is a natural tendency of the bridge to tip forward as strings are tightened during tuning. Once a bridge has become bent through neglect, the cell structure of the wood is crushed and the bridge is permanently damaged.

This is from Paul Hostetter, a luthier. Actually he has everything explained with very nice images here. Worth reading.

http://www.lutherie.net/care.html

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

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