FORUM

Please have a look at our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Dowel
Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 (0 votes) 
Avatar
iarwain
Member
Members
August 13, 2015 - 8:49 pm
Member Since: August 13, 2015
Forum Posts: 4
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hi all.  I got my fiddle out of the closet today and there was some rattling inside of it.  Looks like there is a wooden dowel in there rolling around, it must have come loose from somewhere.  It appears to be barely too big to fit through the f holes.  Anyone know what purpose this part might be serving, or where it's supposed to be?

 

If I took this to a repair person, would they have to pry the top off my instrument to fix it?  Or do they have long tools that they can work through the f holes with?  I'm not sure what their methods might be.

Avatar
Fidelestre
Texas
Members

Regulars
August 13, 2015 - 9:00 pm
Member Since: June 21, 2015
Forum Posts: 240
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Sounds like your soundpost needs to be reset. It sits upright inside the violin and connects the top and bottom sides of the instument. The soundpost is important for the sound quality of the violin. I think they can usually use a special soundpost resetting tool that reaches through the f hole; there should be no need to pry off the top of the instrument unless there is some unusual circumstance.

Avatar
iarwain
Member
Members
August 13, 2015 - 9:13 pm
Member Since: August 13, 2015
Forum Posts: 4
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks for the prompt response, Fidelestre.  You may be right about the soundpost.  I thought it sounded a little deader than I thought it should today, but I just chalked it up to poor technique, lol.  Do you know if this piece is glued in or just kept in place by pressure and friction?

Any chance this could be done by an amateur (myself)?

Avatar
Mark
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
August 13, 2015 - 10:29 pm
Member Since: September 30, 2014
Forum Posts: 290
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Iarwain

Please detune your fiddle until the sound post is reset you can damage your fiddle with out it incerted between the top and back of the fiddle.

 

Mark

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
August 14, 2015 - 2:16 am
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

You CAN do it yourself - relatively easy with a low-cost tool ( soundpost setter ) - but getting it to exactly where it performs best can take a while.  It should be placed (roughly) underneath where the E string crosses the bridge.   There are many places to research this - but here's the wikipedia entry to give you an idea - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_post as a summary.  Also check out @Fiddlerman 's video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=147&v=4rY6ORicq64

- but I would research further info before you embark upon it....  It can be quite "finicky" first time - I spent most of a day (mostly experimenting by making very small position changes within the usable length of the post ).   For an existing soundpost, there are of course limits to how far it can be moved and still stay in place once tensioned before you need something a mm or so shorter or longer - so there are limits to how far you can move it.   But, it would be 5 / 10 minute job for a luthier if you are fortunate enough to have one nearby....

And @Mark makes a good point- you may not believe this, but on a fully tensioned violin there could be up to 20kg pressure on the top plate - without the support of the soundpost between top and bottom plates you could run the risk of either damage or deformation of the top plate over time.   For sure - relax the strings until you get it fixed !

Oh - and no it is not glued - its just a friction fit and keeps in place with the applied downward pressure when tensioned.

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
MrYikes
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
August 14, 2015 - 10:57 am
Member Since: February 11, 2014
Forum Posts: 367
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yes you can do it yourself with a loop of string through a piece of straw.  An unbent paper clip can help hold the bottom when placing the post which should be 2.5 mm from the bridge and centered with the foot.  Then move about as sound dictates.

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
August 14, 2015 - 12:47 pm
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

LOL - indeed @MrYikes - good point !

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
iarwain
Member
Members
August 14, 2015 - 5:13 pm
Member Since: August 13, 2015
Forum Posts: 4
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thanks for the tips, guys.  Sounds like this is a very common occurrence that every fiddler should know how to deal with.  I am admittedly a noob.  I'll get my instrument tuned down right away.  I ordered a tool to help reset the soundpost, although I'm not entirely sure how I'm going to get it out of the fiddle in the first place.

Avatar
MrYikes
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
August 14, 2015 - 10:58 pm
Member Since: February 11, 2014
Forum Posts: 367
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Turn the violin over and let the post roll to the hole.  A straightened paper clip can help.  It takes time the first try, but then it is easy.  Putting in the post can not harm your violin, though you might not get the optimum sound, at least you are able to continue playing.  Later you can pay to have it placed, but to me it is important to learn to do this so that you need not live in fear of the post falling.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
August 15, 2015 - 4:05 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Funny enough, before I learned to work on sound-posts, I never had a post fall on me during my professional career. Lucky I guess but tons of playing in an excess of 25 years before I even thought about resurrecting a sound-post. Now I've probably resurrected, adjusted, cut and set around 1000. LOL

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
iarwain
Member
Members
August 15, 2015 - 4:45 pm
Member Since: August 13, 2015
Forum Posts: 4
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Thanks for all the tips, guys, there are some good ones. 

One more question:   Is the soundpost supposed to go DIRECTLY under the bridge, or a little in front of it (further away from the neck)?  I've read a few articles on this by now, but that particular detail seems a little vague.

Avatar
MrYikes
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
August 15, 2015 - 5:05 pm
Member Since: February 11, 2014
Forum Posts: 367
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Start at 5mm away from the bridge (about the diameter of the sound post).  Try it there and then maybe moving it toward the bridge so that it is 2.5 mm away from the bridge.

Avatar
coolpinkone
California, the place of my heart
Members

Regulars
August 15, 2015 - 6:20 pm
Member Since: January 11, 2012
Forum Posts: 3755
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

I have never had this happen... Thank goodness I know what to do if it does.... Loosen strings.... And cry until I get help.  I know that is just not strong independent violist thinking but I think that is my reality.  Lol

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
August 15, 2015 - 11:08 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
14sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

It should center out to the E string bridge foot and behind more or less like MrYikes suggested. I like to start at half the bridge foots thickness away from the beginning of the diameter and work away slowly. Making sure that the post is standing straight in ever direction is beneficial. There is a slight possibility that the post is too short since it fell to begin with but it could have been set incorrectly from the start as well. Also, it's rare that I pull as sound post out that fits perfectly.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 231

Currently Online: KindaScratchy
36 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming HeadCheese, lakelivr, harvestman, fiddlinmama, kit

Top Posters:

coolpinkone: 3755

Mad_Wed: 2849

Barry: 2661

Fiddlestix: 2637

Oliver: 2439

DanielB: 2379

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1

Members: 3552

Moderators: 0

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 16

Forums: 56

Topics: 6439

Posts: 80299

Newest Members:

dbsimon, stirlingite771, mdedmon, coreshanethi, wisco kid, Yael

Administrators: Fiddlerman: 11694, KindaScratchy: 1650