FORUM

Please have a look at our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Bow and bouncing.
Topic Rating: 3.3 Topic Rating: 3.3 Topic Rating: 3.3 Topic Rating: 3.3 Topic Rating: 3.3 Topic Rating: 3.3 (4 votes) 
Avatar
NoirVelours
Quebec
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
April 25, 2012 - 7:25 pm
Member Since: March 28, 2012
Forum Posts: 822
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I hit bottom on noobishness today. Bouncing bow is usually not a big problem, only occasional and so far it seems it was related to crooked bowing, so easely fixed. Sometimes we get so focused on the music sheet or new fingering that we forget about bowing parallel to the bridge as much as possible.

But today my bowing was ok, and the bouncing was there from the start! I was like huh, ok no I can't blame this on the rain and humidity lol. Well after trying all kind of things and even making my bow more tight I found out the problem was exactly that! I had to loosen up the hair to about one pencil width only at the most narrow part of my bow.

So I researched more and found that playing too close to the bridge tends to make the bow bounce also because the strings are very tight there, so something to be aware of. A rigid pinky can also a cause so keep it curled. Also when we change strings in the balanced zone of the bow, it can make it bounce so we have to be careful about being perpendicular to the strings!

Huh, so my research end up with way too much stuff to be awared of, heck violin is complex!

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

Avatar
cdennyb
King for a Day, Peasant for many
Members

Regulars
April 25, 2012 - 7:37 pm
Member Since: February 13, 2012
Forum Posts: 1774
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

good for you! You're using your new found knowledge and tips from the members here on how to fix your problem(s) after analyzing them. I would've first thought bow hair tightness then excess rosin on the strings.

Nice work NV. thumbs-updancing

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

Avatar
KindaScratchy
Massachusetts
April 25, 2012 - 7:50 pm
Member Since: March 14, 2012
Forum Posts: 1651
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

OMG, a bouncing bow is one of my most persistent and annoying problems! As you pointed out, NV, it seems that there are a number of things that can cause it, so it's hard to pin down exactly what's going on at any given time.

For me, I think that gripping the bow too tightly is the cause more often than not, though I know that I do all of the other things you mentioned, too. I notice that it gets worse when I'm at my lesson (i.e. playing in front of someone) or shooting a video, both times when I'm trying extra hard to play well and, therefore, tense up.

frown

When the work's all done and the sun's settin' low,

I pull out my fiddle and I rosin up the bow.

Avatar
Composer
Regular advisor
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 12:50 am
Member Since: July 12, 2011
Forum Posts: 177
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Bouncing bow is simply the most obvious flaw one encounters in working with the bow.  I gave up on bullet list quick fix solutions because I stopped deluding myself that correct bow technique is trivial or that the "Just do it 10,000 times" philosophy would lead me to the promised land. 

So today I retired my mirror in favor of a webcam and have started working through the exercises in the first 2 chapters of Fischer's 'Basics'.

Avatar
Composer
Regular advisor
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 1:04 am
Member Since: July 12, 2011
Forum Posts: 177
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

But anyhoo, my latest quack analysis of bow ailments are:

a. That curved pinky may be a weak one.  Try performing fingerstroke or the bow stroke Colle exercises in the lower half of the bow. 

b. Rigid thumb (web cam analysis is good here)

c. You are not supposed to control horizontal bow angle adjustments with the arm.  The fingers are used for this. 

But seriously, I am on a jihad that 99% of beginners fail to realize what the gold standard exercise for bowing straight even is.  And that is step 1 of learning the violin.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
April 26, 2012 - 6:03 am
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694

Videoing yourself for self analysis is a great idea.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
NoirVelours
Quebec
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 7:38 am
Member Since: March 28, 2012
Forum Posts: 822
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Late yesterday night I went through my checklist, starting with the tension on the bow since the other points are rarely an issue now. Perfect practice in terms of no bouncing only! I was extremely happy and gained immediate confidence with Brahm's Lullaby and started on the slurs instead of just concentrating on fingering. I keep in mind the other points but tight bow really was my occasional problem! I will have to keep a journal to remember all those little tips and advice I keep learnign from you guys and on the web each day thumbs-up

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
April 26, 2012 - 11:02 am
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694

What do you mean when you say tight bow? A bow should not be too tight.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
NoirVelours
Quebec
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 12:12 pm
Member Since: March 28, 2012
Forum Posts: 822
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I mean I was turning the screw too much and it was making my bow bounce, now I keep it around 1 pencil wide and it's perfect.

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
April 26, 2012 - 12:38 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
3

Bingo. Pencil wide. I never thought of using that as a guide. You make a good teacher. Thanks

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Fiddlestix
Michigan, USA
King
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 12:42 pm
Member Since: January 21, 2012
Forum Posts: 2637
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

The pencil width is in one of the video's she watched,,,,, I watched the same video.

violin_girl

Avatar
NoirVelours
Quebec
Honorary tenured advisor
Members

Regulars
April 26, 2012 - 1:11 pm
Member Since: March 28, 2012
Forum Posts: 822
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
3

No credit for me, it's on Ehow, and also here and here and here, and almost every videos on Youtube I find concerning violin bow, so no big secret. I cross reference a lot with many ressources they all agree on the pencil!

"It can sing like a bird, it can cry like a human being, it can be very angry, it can be all that humans are" Maxim Vengerov

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
April 26, 2012 - 6:44 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
13sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

You just take the credit ok??????
I prefer giving it to you. 🙂

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 231

Currently Online: Jim Dunleavy
34 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming HeadCheese, lakelivr, harvestman, fiddlinmama, kit

Top Posters:

coolpinkone: 3755

Mad_Wed: 2849

Barry: 2661

Fiddlestix: 2637

Oliver: 2439

DanielB: 2379

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1

Members: 3552

Moderators: 0

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 16

Forums: 56

Topics: 6439

Posts: 80300

Newest Members:

dbsimon, stirlingite771, mdedmon, coreshanethi, wisco kid, Yael

Administrators: Fiddlerman: 11694, KindaScratchy: 1651