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High Positions "Creep" - advice please
-- After playing in 3rd-5th position and switch back to 1st, I find myself almost a whole step higher.
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fiddlrgrrl
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March 11, 2015 - 2:47 am
Member Since: January 23, 2012
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If you know Mozart's "Glorious Is Thy Name" (pic below) I play most of it in 3rd position.  The last several triumphant measures are all high C and B ( 3rd position on the E string) with the typical ending in the last notes on C on the G string.  I am able to play that low C in either 1st or 3rd, but the problem is, by the time I've finished all last page with the high notes and hit that low C, I realize I've creeped up in small increments un-noticable to me at this point, but it's almost a whole step so the last note C, if I shift back to 1st position, sucks, and if I play it from 3rd position, it's wrong.

I had placed tape last year on the 3rd and 5th position last year, but took it off and have been consciously working to shift correctly and "feel" where my palm hits the violin each place.  I feel like relying on tape would be a step back, and wouldn't solve this problem because it sneaks up on me after I have shifted up correctly.

Suggestions?

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Fiddlrgrrl

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Schaick
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March 11, 2015 - 9:07 am
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I have just recently started learning to shift but maybe this will help -  

I hold the neck of the violin a bit different - my thumb extends up into the beginning curve of the scroll. Not only does it help me get back to 1st after muted chunking, it has helped me get back into first position.

I need to speed up the transition though!!  

Violinist start date -  May 2013  

Fiddler start date - May 2014

FIDDLE- Gift from a dear friend. A 1930-40 german copy, of a french copy of a Stradivarius.  BOW - $50 carbon fiber. Strings - Dominants with E Pirastro Gold string.

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fiddlrgrrl
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March 11, 2015 - 11:59 am
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@Schaick  I'll mess around with that.  Is your thumb actually on the back where the scroll curves out a bit, or is it on the side, under the peg?

Fiddlrgrrl

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Fiddlerman
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March 11, 2015 - 2:53 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
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 Tape is definitely a step back plus you get reliant on a mark in which you need to glance at.

I would practice shifting back and forth for a determined amount of time every day until the shift feels normal, natural and comfortable. Until you shift into higher positions you don't really need to come around the violin too much but it helps to be closer to that ultimate position.

Use a combination of muscle, elbow bend, shift distance memory combined with position feel memory. Edge of violin if that is where you end up for example. The feeling that you get when you get to that position.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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coolpinkone
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March 11, 2015 - 4:59 pm
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Thanks Pierre.. I have noticed now when occasionally using my fourth finger that I can end up with a bit of a "creeping".. it drives me nuts... nothing major..but by 1/2 step sometimes.

What you say about just shifting and feeling and memorizing how it feels makes sense.    I will try that tonight.  I mean I have heard this before, but you know how sometimes before when you hear something its not the right time or I was too dense to absorb... or daft or something.. :)  

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

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fiddlrgrrl
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March 11, 2015 - 9:49 pm
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@Fiddlerman Thanks! I have just spent over an hour doing exactly what you said, just shifting between 1st, 3rd and 5th positions repeatedly, and I see that some muscle, touch, and distance memory does develop. Those words planted concepts in my mind that I could focus on. I only opened my eyes at intervals to get a visual picture of where the heel of my hand, and my wrist, touch the violin.  That helps too, I think.  I see some improvement! After I take a break I'll try playing the Mozart again to see if I can hit that pesky last note right.

I suppose the creeping won't be a problem when I'm playing with the group, as I'll hear them for a reference.  It happens when I'm alone.

The other thing I did tonight is to separate out the sections of Sevcik that are specifically about the positions, and I'm going to work on exercises specifically for 3rd and 5th for now, because that applies to the concert music coming up Sunday. But after looking at how it's all laid out, I see the value in studying it sequentially so I'll put that specifically in my practice routine.

It's so helpful to get comments from others.  Even the process of articulating what I'm trying to figure out is very helpful.

I've thought of another thing or two I want to post after I figure out where they belong.

Fiddlrgrrl

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Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
March 12, 2015 - 1:10 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694

I'm glad my tips helped you guys. :)

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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