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Pas Des Deux - Tchaikovsky
Symbol meaning..???
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Kiara
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August 5, 2014 - 2:49 am
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Hellooooo

Not sure if this is the correct area to ask this question but here goes...

We have just started playing Pas Des Deux from Tchaikovsky's Nutcracker and there is a symbol/marking that I am not sure what it means, I could probably find out this week at orchestra but thought it would be quicker to ask here...

Thanks laugh

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Kiara
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August 5, 2014 - 2:51 am
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Hmmm, not sure how to put the photo so it is automatically seen without having to click on it... facepalm

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BillyG
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August 5, 2014 - 4:54 am
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Tremolo (just possibly....) ( but how you do that between two notes though, beats me right now - LOL ! )

Bill

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Ferret
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August 5, 2014 - 5:27 am
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Could it be a 

Caesura
Indicates a brief, silent pause, during which time is not counted. In ensemble playing, time resumes when the conductor or leader indicates.

Hey, taking a 'punt' here. Don't really know. It looks a bit like one :)

If you don't find what it is here, let us all know when you find out at orchestra. Would like to know

Seen it all. Done it all. Can't remember most of dunno ..... What was I saying???? facepalm

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BillyG
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August 5, 2014 - 9:22 am
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@Ferret - ahhh... new one to me - but that sounds more likely...  someone will come to our rescue !

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coolpinkone
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August 5, 2014 - 11:27 am
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Eagerly awaiting the reply or answer to this.  Good thought John... That sounds reasonable.  🙂

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

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Kiara
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August 5, 2014 - 5:05 pm
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Hmm could be Tremolo but I think the marking is usually on the note itself....

The Caesura could be right too....

I had a suspicion that it could be some sort of repeat, but could be wrong. We'll have to wait until someone else replies! 😀 

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RosinedUp
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August 5, 2014 - 6:51 pm
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Not sure, looks like it means to repeat the notes of the previous beat.

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Barry
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There is no shame in playing twinkle, youre playing Mozart

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Kiara
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August 5, 2014 - 7:36 pm
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Thanks RU and Barry.

@RosinedUp I think you could be right with the repeat of the last beat.

@Barry, thanks for the link, I had a look at that before and couldn't find anything that matched the closest was the Caesura that Ferret was talking about.

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Barry
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Kiara said
Thanks RU and Barry.

@RosinedUp I think you could be right with the repeat of the last beat.

@Barry, thanks for the link, I had a look at that before and couldn't find anything that matched the closest was the Caesura that Ferret was talking about.

It is baffling as the three slashes for tremolo should be on the note and its only two for Caesura.   Let us know what they say at orchestra

There is no shame in playing twinkle, youre playing Mozart

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Fiddlerman
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August 6, 2014 - 12:49 pm
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Sorry I just saw this post.

Repeat the proceeding beat. IOW, play those eight 32nd notes twice. If you had posted the whole measure everyone would have seen that there are beats missing if not for that symbol. If my memory serves right, there are about 6 measures of this kind of marking. You possibly neglected the measures proceeding this which are also repeated in the same way. Those triplets for example are often not all written out. Often we see two lines but the 3 lines indicate 32nd notes which they are in this case and correctly noted.

When parts were written by hand it was much easier to write it out this way. :)

Enjoy the Nutcracker, it's a fun piece to perform.

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coolpinkone
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August 6, 2014 - 1:12 pm
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Very cool info! Thanks Pierre. :)

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

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BillyG
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August 6, 2014 - 2:15 pm
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Aha!   So @RosinedUp - you got it! Well done !

Thanks FM - ah - the old days before copy and paste - I remember those - makes a lot of sense!  LOL

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Kiara
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August 6, 2014 - 4:54 pm
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Thanks Pierre @fiddlerguy that was my suspicion. Yes, I should have posted the picture with a bit more context. Thanks for the help! Now I just have to work out how to play them, lol. facepalm

@RosinedUp good job RU, you were right after all.smile

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Fiddlerman
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August 6, 2014 - 5:26 pm
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Make a video question for more personal help. :)

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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RosinedUp
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August 6, 2014 - 7:16 pm
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Fiddlerman said

When parts were written by hand it was much easier to write it out this way. :)

Could it still be better to write it with the repeat symbol?  It gives more information. The player could know at a glance that it's a repeat and then go into repeat mode, and the eyes could be looking ahead to something else.  But what do I know, I'm hardly a sight reader, ha ha.  What do you think?

Kiara said

@RosinedUp good job RU, you were right after all.smile

ty and yw

@BillyG ty

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Fiddlerman
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August 6, 2014 - 9:37 pm
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RosinedUp said

Fiddlerman said

When parts were written by hand it was much easier to write it out this way. :)

Could it still be better to write it with the repeat symbol?  It gives more information. The player could know at a glance that it's a repeat and then go into repeat mode, and the eyes could be looking ahead to something else.  But what do I know, I'm hardly a sight reader, ha ha.  What do you think?

It's still done that way but not as often. You're right, it's easier to sight read this way. The more repetitive it is the more confusing when it is written out many times. This way we only need to keep track of the changes and count how many times we've played a pattern.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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