FORUM

Please have a look at our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
Bad Hair Day? Bow quality question.
Did I get a bad bow for $70?
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (2 votes) 
Avatar
outoftune
Members
November 5, 2014 - 9:53 pm
Member Since: November 5, 2014
Forum Posts: 35
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

      I am very new to playing the violin and I have questions on bow quality. Recently I picked up a Cecillio CEVN-1NA Yep, a very solid violin,but to keep prices down they ship with cheap bow. So, needless to say, after some research I bought a better bow for $70 What I got looked worst than the bow that came with the violin. I have yet to open the sealed plastic sleeve in case I need to return it. I need your opinion on this bow as I took some pics. Is my bow just having a bad hair day or is this a crap bow? Its been rather cool and dry here in Vermont,but had recently rained. Not sure if its humidity doing this.

I wish to share the hair on my new bow, so whats the best way to share the imaged? I have the image posted on my blog,but I don't wish to spam the forums.

Avatar
outoftune
Members
November 5, 2014 - 10:15 pm
Member Since: November 5, 2014
Forum Posts: 35
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Ok I figured it out. The bow is still sealed in its package. There is a small gap in the center of the hair. As I have no experience with violin bows, is this how it should look when new and not tightened? DSC_0416.JPGImage EnlargerDSC_0411.JPGImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Tucson1
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
November 5, 2014 - 11:30 pm
Member Since: September 19, 2013
Forum Posts: 234
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hey Outof ...

Name and model of yer new bow please ...read reviews of same ....look at videos of bow hair care ....and no , you can't tell much without tightening the bow hair to playing configuration ....may just need a wet or dry combing and some rosin ....i recomend powder rosin on a new bow ....but really , check some videos ...there's more than one school of thought on most every violin issue ...violin-1267

Avatar
cdennyb
King for a Day, Peasant for many
Members

Regulars
November 6, 2014 - 1:45 am
Member Since: February 13, 2012
Forum Posts: 1774
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Welcome to the group... Hope you find lots of answers to your incredible number of questions. (Yes, you will have a lot of questions) That's the cool part about life here, there's always someone available with experience in those areas. We were all a beginner at some time and we're all here to help you out. thumbs-up

All of my bows look like cheap crap when they are loose, but tighten them up to playing tension and they all take on a look of a professional bow.

Keep in mind that new bow probably doesn't have any rosin on it either and that will tend to allow the hairs to separate like an unmanageable mess.

Here's what a close up of bow hair looks like that has a nice even coating of rosin on it.

hats_off

PA220010.JPGImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

Avatar
BillyG
Far North-west Scotland
Members

Regulars
November 6, 2014 - 5:54 am
Member Since: March 22, 2014
Forum Posts: 1635
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Welcome, @outoftune !!!

  Out of habit, I always relax the tension on my bow when I've finished playing (probably not so essential on the Carbon Fiber bow, but still advisable) - and my bow-hair when relaxed looks much like your images.

  Although, if you have doubts, do as Tucs suggested - name the make and model - there's a fair chance someone on the forum uses the same bow, or has tried it at some time.

Bill

I seriously recommend not copying my mistakes.  

Please make your own, different mistakes, and help us all learn :-)

Avatar
coolpinkone
California, the place of my heart
Members

Regulars
November 6, 2014 - 12:01 pm
Member Since: January 11, 2012
Forum Posts: 3754
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I agree with the gang here.. Tighten up the bow and see how it looks.   :)

Cool magnification photo Den.

Vibrato Desperato.... Desperately seeking vibrato

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
November 6, 2014 - 12:58 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694

I'm 99% sure that this (what everyone is suggesting above) is the situation.

However, if you are worried about taking off the plastic in case you must return the bow, don't be. First of all, if there was something wrong with the bow, the dealer should take it back no matter what. We accept returns if a buyer says they changed their minds and don't want to play violin anymore. We don't need an excuse. Fortunately, returns are extremely rare for us. But if something is wrong with the bow and the dealer wants to sell it anyway, they have plenty of plastic sleeves they can repack the bow with later in any case. :)

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
outoftune
Members
November 9, 2014 - 10:19 am
Member Since: November 5, 2014
Forum Posts: 35
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thank you for all the great replies. I am a bit more confidant now and will be unwrapping and reviewing this bow on my Youtube channel. The bow in question is the Fiddlermans Carbon Fiber bow and I'm sure that the quality is awesome, I just don't know yet what to look at on a new bow. Unfortunately there is not a music store or violin shop within driving distance of where I live. (not even sure if there is a violin teacher in the area).

Avatar
cdennyb
King for a Day, Peasant for many
Members

Regulars
November 9, 2014 - 11:20 am
Member Since: February 13, 2012
Forum Posts: 1774
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

well, unless you want to produce some "chuckles" at a music store I'd rosin that thing up and tighten it up until the hair's about a pencil thickness off the bow and play it!dancingPlay it like you stole it!devil-violin

Ain't nothing wrong with those bows, they're fantastic!thumbs-up

After you've been playing for a year or two, then you can wonder about looks of the hair. Until then, one thing at a time and you just need a lot of time. LoL

When looking at a NEW bow, even an old bow that is just new to you, here's some places and things to consider.

1- Is the bow straight? (Does it have any twists or bows in it as you look down from the frog towards the tip with the hair on the top as you look at it under tension. Don't confuse the required "camber" with being straight.)

2- Is the clamp band secure and positioned all the way up on the frog? (Is the hair completely restrained and has no loose areas)

3- Does the tightening screw move easily? (Is the screw all the way to the limit of it's travel or is there a lot of threads left when tightening the hair up. Maxxed out is an indication of stretched hair or slipped hair in the frog or tip holes or just plain ol wore out hair strands.)

4- Is the hair properly layered across the whole width? (Hairs missing would show up as a thin portion on one side or the other or even in the middle. Depending on the quality and age, the number of hair strands should be in the 220-250 range as built. Some have an exact number in their head but seldom will you find a bow that we (beginners can afford) get that will adhere to that standard. High end, (several thousand dollars) bows will be more in line with the industry standard of qty.)

5- Are there a lot of broken hair stubs sticking out from under the frog band or at the tip? (Lots of broken hairs could indicate an old bow with hair that needs replaced, or a bow that's been hammered during playing like you get from Charlie Daniels or Doug Kershaw type bluegrass playing!)

6- Looking at the tip does it have any indications of a past repair? (Cracked tips or broken tips can be repaired but you're not buying or getting a perfect player if it has. A lot of repaired bows will sound just fine and you would'nt even know they had been broken and repaired unless someone told you.)

These are just some of the things that would catch my eye when inspecting a bow. Although you need some education as to what and how much are acceptable conditions that are different from one bow to another, for the most part, you won't find anything "wrong" with a FM carbon fiber bow. Use it as a measuring stick against others you might get to look at.hats_off

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

Avatar
outoftune
Members
November 9, 2014 - 12:07 pm
Member Since: November 5, 2014
Forum Posts: 35
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

lol, I've already produce some 'chuckles' lol Took me two days of rosining my bow to realize I had to score the top of the rosin before any could get on to the bow. lol There will be lots of great chuckles on my youtube show. I've been using the rosin,bow and strings that came with my Cecilio electric violin.

Avatar
cdennyb
King for a Day, Peasant for many
Members

Regulars
November 9, 2014 - 1:38 pm
Member Since: February 13, 2012
Forum Posts: 1774
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

The good thing about "everybody" here on FM.com is that we've all had the same issues and found the same conclusions and answers as we have progressed. In the future please don't suffer thru something like the rosin thing, jump on here and ask!

We all love to help out so if you wonder about something, have a "what you think is a stupid" question just remember someone on here has already been there and done that...you ain't the first.

 

party

"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein

Avatar
Mark
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
November 9, 2014 - 10:38 pm
Member Since: September 30, 2014
Forum Posts: 290
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Just a quick question all looking for some opinions/past experience - I have an Pernambuco bow that I re-haired 30 years ago, while the hair appears fine, It seems I have to rosin it quite frequently, every day or every other day to keep a good tone. Would it be money well spent to re-hair it now or wait till the current hairs are worn ready for replacement?  Any thoughts

 

Thanks,

 

Mark 

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
November 9, 2014 - 10:46 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
13sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

Every day or other day sounds like you don't need to rosin it hardly at all. That to me is no indication that it needs to be rehaired. Is it missing a lot of hair?
How many hours a day do you play on average?
If it was last rehaired 30 years ago, I am guessing you need to re-hair.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Mark
Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
November 9, 2014 - 10:58 pm
Member Since: September 30, 2014
Forum Posts: 290
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
14sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Fiddlerman,

Hairs appear to be in good shape I have another bow that is 5 to 7  years old that I have to rosin frequently not a frequent as the original bow I got with the violin the hairs look good on it also. They just sat in the case all these years till i started playing again 4 months ago or so. Normally I practice 45 to 90 mins a day my other bow is 5 years old.

 

Mark

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
November 9, 2014 - 11:06 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 11694
15sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

In that case, sounds good. :)

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Forum Timezone: America/New_York

Most Users Ever Online: 231

Currently Online:
46 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming HeadCheese, Ginnysg, lakelivr, harvestman, fiddlinmama

Top Posters:

coolpinkone: 3754

Mad_Wed: 2849

Barry: 2661

Fiddlestix: 2637

Oliver: 2439

DanielB: 2379

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1

Members: 3549

Moderators: 0

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 16

Forums: 56

Topics: 6439

Posts: 80294

Newest Members:

coreshanethi, wisco kid, Yael, tobypaul, Yogesh Thakur, Eudora

Administrators: Fiddlerman: 11694, KindaScratchy: 1650