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picklefish said
Its a trick question. Good as defined by whom? Yes, im thinking too much sorry, Devils advocate. I think it will take the rest of my life at this rate.
I think pickle is right on this one..
Wow man, you're good.. You're gettin good…. You are good… you're really good… that's good enough… I'm good, right ?…. just how good are you ?….can you play that song good ?…. I'm good enough to play on radio…. i'm not good enough to play in the orchestra quite yet but someday, I will. And the finale……
Someday I'll play as GOOD as……………….Pierre ! 
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I believe that we can't decide when we are good enough but if we enjoy what we are doing and what we can do for the moment it could be satisfaction enough. Look forward only for motivation and not for verification. Sometimes we work hard at something and all of a sudden it just clicks.
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To decide how good I am I simply judge how good the people are that I might play with.
Even though I have been tinkering with the violin for a long time, it has been really the last 3 years that have made the difference.
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Daniel said -
I mean, do you have somebody standing there with a clipboard and listening..
"Ooops, that quarter note in bar 20 was off by over 5 centimes.. Bad dog! No Biscuit!"
…or something like that?
Daniel, almost exactly that,,, except for the biscuit part,,, we use Bud Light, lmao!
At every single lesson, my teacher gives me guidance on virtually every single note I play during practice, whether it's high or low. It is one huge benefit of lessons. I can hear about 70% of my "off" notes and correct them myself and the rest, my teacher points out. This immediate feedback for that 60 – 120 min.s (he's very generous with his time) makes the correct pitch definite in my head, I'm not usually guessing whether or not I'm on or off.
Maybe it sounds grueling, but VERY helpful to me; I like that immediate feedback. We WORK during every lesson,,, I have FUN on my own. My teacher keeps track during every lesson of my accuracy; nothing scientific, no clipboard or stroke counter, no electric shock for poor notes, just his estimation… and each day is different. In the past 3 weeks, on average, he's put my pitch accuracy at about 85% – 95%. And there's nothing magical about 95%, it's just a number that he believes is "pretty decent play" for a 1 yr old (I like "violin years" btw).
And, btw, there are a lot of factors that influence that accuracy at any moment unfortunately; people in the room, hangover, feeling rushed, feeling "off", etc. I think that's part of being a "pro", it's like riding a bike; you just own it regardless of conditions because either you're "up" on your bike or you're on the ground (and obviously don't own that skill).
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I think that playing to your own satisfaction make's you good, if you like it ok, if not then keep practicing until you do.
Myself, I don't play from sheet music, although I can read music, but if I were to buy every piece of music of the song's I think about in a day's time, no way could I afford it. I play by ear….. mostly. When I'm watching TV I hear a particular song I like, I pick up my fiddle next to me and start playing it. However if I play it so many time's and I thinik it's "Good Enough" to record and do a video, the song is not the really cool song it started out to be. You play a song, 80 – 150 time's while adding your own riffs and doing your own rendition and arrangement, it get's old… fast.
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Ken, that's what I want to be able to do someday; know my violin so well that I can pick it up and start playing (or pick it out) a song that I hear; and then to be good enough to embellish it with my own character,,,,,, that would be my idea of FUN!
Today's lesson was very cool for me. Last week I told my teacher that I had found sheet music (an easy v. and a really difficult v.) to "Tennessee Waltz", which I've always loved. I was able to nail the easy version before my lesson last week and asked my teacher if he thought I could do the harder v. and he encouraged me to go for it. This v. has techniques that I've not yet tried (triplets & certain bowing patterns) So he gave me some pointers and all week I worked at getting it the best I could. So by this morning's lesson I was able to muddle (and I mean that in the messiest sense) my way through it. Then for 90 min.s this morning he helped me break the song down into pieces (2 or 3 bars at a time) that took me as much as 15 min.s to nail just those couple of bars. So this week I'm going to try to master the "chunks" and put it all together.
This song is a huge challenge for me but the funny experience I had was,,, hey, I'm focusing ALL of my efforts on these specific techniques,,,, but then my teacher and I both noticed that,,, hey, my pitch (without thinking about it at all) was really not bad at all. It was thrilling (as lame as that sounds, lol).
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I taught myself Tennessee waltz by ear, Ive never looked at any sheet music for it. Heres a video of me playing it 2 years ago Ive improved on it since then of course.
Bach Rules !!!
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Very nice, Barry…. sounded sweet. I just can't figure out how you can play the violin at a 90 degree angle, some notes looks like you're almost upside down with the bow.
Another thing,,,,,, where do you get the backing tracks,,, i've looked and looked and I can't find anything like it.
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Barry, I notice your bow grip was even more of a fiddle bow grip than I have seen of late. As you learn clasical are you holding the bow in a more clasical type of hold. I only ask because I am totally interested in the difference and what is in common between the two styles. You have gotten me enjoying old time music.
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I'm not sure why Barry does it, but my thinking is for quicker bow action while playing bluegrass, Irish tune's and plain ole fiddle tune stuff.
I find I can get quicker responce if I "choke" up on the bow,, for classical, I hole it more at the frog. I think it's for getting the full use of the bow length.
That's my reasoning, anyway.
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That was beautiful Barry! Can't believe you got all of that by ear!
The version that I'm working on has a crap-load more embellishments in it that you might find fun,,, these will probably be a lot easier for you than me (if you're interested of course).
Here's the sheet & an mp3 (my teacher not me unfortunately, lmao)
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Fred, Iy sounds like a classical player trying to play old time music. The long bow strokes just don't work for me here.
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@ fiddlestix..I dont recall where i found the Tennessee Waltz backing track but I now use this site that a man by the name of Josh runs. you can request tracks if they are old time and he'll put them up when he has time..all real instruments none of the Midi stuff
http://www.oldtimejam.com/Jam.html
@ fred… I do a much better version now I had just learned the song when I made this video, mostly to hear myself. As for the playing by ear, you have to take into consideration that I was raised on this music so I can hear it in my head as I play it so it comes fairly natural for me
@Kevin…I still choke up on the bow but not that much anymore. now its more like my pinky on the silver. As a fiddler I believe you find what works for you . I recently watched an irish fiddler that made my choke look classical. Its funny, no one on a fiddle forum has ever said a word about my hold, I only hear about it on sites that are classical based.
Bach Rules !!!
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When you can snatch the pepple from my hand you will be ready!
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heres some really great backing tracks with 3 different speeds each..after clicking on the link scroll through the thread, lots of pages of free tracks
Bach Rules !!!
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@Barry: thanks for bring up the Tennessee Waltz. I hadn't thought of this song in a while. This is one of my parents' favorite songs.
@Fred: thanks for posting the sheet music and mp3! I'm gonna try to learn it then play it for them if I can get through it decently.
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Speaking of the Tennessee Waltz, I just came across this on Youtube.
This kid is very cute and very good. The violin is bigger than he is.
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Haaaaaa! Kevin, that's EXACTLY what that rendition is,,, a classically trained violinist doing a fiddle tune…. but throughout my life I've heard the "smooth" v. and the fiddle v. and I love em both!
Barry – GREAT links, thanks, I'm going to work at playing along with those. You certainly come up with some terrific tools!
Diane, same here; this has always been a favorite of mine (even as a kid), and one of my mom's favs, the song reminds me of her (she passed away two yrs ago of cancer) and I hope to do a vid in her honor when I feel comfortable with it.
And what a cute kid (in that vid); I can't even describe how I envy kids who started violin/fiddle so young, and get to master it their entire lives!
Erich said, "When you can snatch the pepple from my hand you will be ready!" Erick,when I was a teen, "Kung Fu" was my all-time fav show,,, I practiced hours at hand speed,,,, there was NOBODY that kept the pebble from me,,, yeah, I was a pretty annoying kid, lmao,,,,, I did get "good enough" at THAT, a lot of good that did me, haaaaaa (actually it did).
HEY, speaking of hand speed, I'm going to start another thread about triplets, I've got a question I know a lot of you can help with.
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