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swallowtail jig
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (2 votes) 
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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 3:55 pm
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I am trying to get round the mental block I get every time I record, its starting to get annoying now, I am thinking of asking fiddlerman how to get round it, if he knows anyway to do it.

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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Mouse
February 8, 2021 - 4:23 pm
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That sounds good.

I can totally relate to the recording issue. 

The Bumblebee Flies!

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ELCBK
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February 8, 2021 - 5:25 pm
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@stringy -

I know you're getting frustrated and I'm not exactly the voice of wisdom here, but you just don't look relaxed. 

I've been trying to figure out why and wondering how much of an impact this has when you record. 

From your camera point of view, the way you hold your violin and have your right arm/elbow so high for these fiddle tunes, it just seems it would be hard to relax. 

If you could adjust your shoulder rest to drop the right edge of your violin down a little you might be able to relax your whole bowing arm.  Then I think you'd have an easier time of loosening your wrist/fingers, also.

I think this video of Casey Willis has the best camera angle - to see what I'm talking about.

 

 

Thank you for sharing this tune. 

 

https://butterflywebsite.com/images/tiger-swallowtail.jpg

 

Swallowtail is on my list, but haven't played it yet.

- Emily

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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 5:25 pm
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Its weird I can play a tune perfectly, and then as soon as I record I can hea the mistakes and cant help myself, I tense up.

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 5:30 pm
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Emily You are absolutely correct, I am not tense when I practice and the bowing flows, the problem is I have to record to hear were I go wrong, and as soon as I do record, everything is out the window,all the fluidity, wrist movement ,everything goes.I can get tunes out but they are nothing like the way I play in practice.

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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katie m
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February 8, 2021 - 5:34 pm
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I thought it was excellent I really liked the first half! I’m the same I go wrong as soon as someone watches me or if I try to record myself! 

I’m really impressed with your Swallow Tail jig though I tried it once and gave up straight away.

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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 5:38 pm
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Thats not abad idea about the shoulder rest either, I have had trouble from the very beginning with rests, this is my third one, just cant get them right, I even have one of those bon musica that hooks onthe shoulder, I am now thinking of designing my own.

I need it high at the back so I dont have to lean my head on it, but like you say low at the front. I know the fiddle is supposed to hook on the collar bone but I just cant get it comfortable

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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ELCBK
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February 8, 2021 - 5:39 pm
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I wish I had some super user-friendly, editing software for my phone - so I could just keep playing until I'm relaxed (if that's possible).  Then I'd cut off all the bad stuff, but I haven't figured out how to do that, yet. (lol) 

I've been through quite a few rests - really got down to serious modification on a few. 

I'm using a "Suretone" rest now, but I'm sure you know what you need to get something to work for you.

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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 5:55 pm
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Thanks Katie much appreciated, its the recording that gets me, believe it or not I dont have nerves at all performing live, if its singing, banjo, guitar or anything. I think a lot has to do with the fiddle itself requiring such concentration. When you play in front of an audience the first thing I learned was that they have cloth ears and because the music isnt repeated tend not hear the bad notes, on guitar especially if you make a mistake thenext time you play that phrase you dothe same again so people think its part of the tune lol, but on a recording you know it has to be perfect which creates pressure and tenseness which is fatal for the fiddle,thanks for saying you thought it was good as my playing at the moment is awful,I will improve though

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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ELCBK
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February 8, 2021 - 5:56 pm
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Wittner makes some pretty freaky space-age looking shoulder rests! 

There's a discussion here about one of them. 

https://fiddlerman.com/forum/t...../page-2/ 

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stringy
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February 8, 2021 - 5:57 pm
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ELCBK said
I wish I had some super user-friendly, editing software for my phone - so I could just keep playing until I'm relaxed (if that's possible).  Then I'd cut off all the bad stuff, but I haven't figured out how to do that, yet. (lol) 

I've been through quite a few rests - really got down to serious modification on a few. 

I'm using a "Suretone" rest now, but I'm sure you know what you need to get something to work for you.

  

I have a couple of radical ideas that I am going to try

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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Mark
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February 9, 2021 - 12:27 am
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stringy,

I understand the phenomenon of being able to sing, play bass guitar or guitar and are relaxed and able to perform with no issues, I've done it for over 45 years,

But put the fiddle in my hands and I'm a wreck!!

Last week at lesson I could not play a couple of songs I had been working on and thought I had them down pretty well, talk about madding.

My instructor (a young lady) just giggled and said I know you can play them better I've heard you,

She then related to me she had done the same thing with her teacher.

Appears to be a regular occurrence with the fiddle. 

 

Mark

Master the Frog and you have mastered the bow.

Albert Sammons

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stringy
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February 9, 2021 - 6:26 am
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Thanks for that mark, it really is an odd phenomenon, just have to persevere and hope it gets better eventually.

Bit more, bit more, snap #*÷?×[email protected]?#[email protected]

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ELCBK
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February 9, 2021 - 9:35 am
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@stringy -

You were talking about needing a tall enough shoulder rest. 

  https://i.pinimg.com/236x/21/70/54/217054aeadf2f76dc2db471aa2a3d347--smiley-faces-good-ideas.jpg

 

What about working with a tall chin rest?  ...or combination.

You are playing better, Ron!   

 

Btw, thank you again - all this is helping me focus on trying to relax. 

- Emily

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GregW
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February 9, 2021 - 10:23 am
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Nice playing @stringy thats some pretty fast playing there!  .. I think if I had to pick playing along with a group or especially in a live situation to an audience over playing to a camera...id pick the live playing and not worry about the recording part so much... you can always hit stop and start again on the camera if your shooting for a perfect take.  theres no hiding playing live or in a group.  on the flipside.. playing with a group does help pull you in more to their groove and it helps the intonation when you have other fiddlers there.  provided they arent playing above the speed you can hit.  thats always been ONE of my hurdles...the speed.  So maybe its the group or band feel youre missing which you could solve by playing along to a backing track or a recording of a session.. It seems like your being a little hard on yourself about the recording thing..which may be part of whats causing your problem.  instead of recording for 1 tune..maybe start it and record your practice and then at the end just tranaition into playing the tune youre shooting for. either way, i think your playing good and coming along great with your sound.  concentrate on the things that you dont like instead of the whole tune.  maybe just a section or a particular measure..tone..or groove.  not sure what youre not liking about your playing here but whatever it is just concentrate on that specifically instead of getting a perfect take.

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ELCBK
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February 9, 2021 - 11:12 am
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Great points, Greg - and you always look relaxed! 

I think if I was ever going join in with other fiddlers I'd have to resort to playing every 3rd... er, every 10th note - just to keep up. (lol) 

Has anyone every asked any of these old super speedy Fiddlers how long it took them to get really good AND fast at 1 tune? 

 

giphy.gif

 

- Emily

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GregW
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February 9, 2021 - 11:31 am
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I speak of live and group playing because @stringy doesnt have a problem there..its a common experience I was relating to since he was describing his situation..and not as a show of  some wisdom..  some develop speed faster than others..its like everything else..we are where we are and it isnt a competetion or race.    each has their own goals and strengths..and things that need to be worked on.  thats what I think we are sharing in here.  

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ELCBK
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February 9, 2021 - 11:41 am
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@GregW -

I edited my post - just thought you made valid points. 

But still curious how long it took our favorite fiddlers to get fast - days... years? 

 

- Emily

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GregW
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February 9, 2021 - 11:56 am
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Its not something that i think can be measured really..each is different... and whats fast?  whats slow?  my goals are different than yours I would guess thats why speed is more on my mind.  when i have played in a group i identified that as a personal thing i needed to work on because i had that experience...i sorta pick up that youre aiming more for tone and ornamentation and being able to play tunes you like the way you like.  neither goal should be looked at negatively and just because one is discussed it shouldnt be viewed as being cynical against the other.   @stringy has a goal of getting better when the record light is on..i just thought i could share something of help.  

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ELCBK
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February 9, 2021 - 12:49 pm
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@GregW -

Thanx for that, Greg.

I can only observe everyone in a video group setting playing these Irish tunes - and they play fast (yes, faster than I'd care to). 

I think stringy has had the unique opportunity to grow up seeing more live traditional Irish sessions locally than many of us (but not now with covid).  I assume they play "at speed" (fast) and it's a huge influence. 

So many of the Fiddlers I see in these sessions have been playing for many, many years - made me wonder how much is time a factor in playing tunes "up to speed".

I think my real point here is do we need to put so much stress upon ourselves (as beginners) when we 1st learn a tune - to play it fast? 

Then again, Kevin Burke has mentioned he thinks it's best to learn and play tunes "at speed" - ASAP! 

Meant no judgement either way - many of us have trouble relaxing while recording, just looking at possible factors.

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