Welcome to our forum. A Message To Our New and Prospective Members . Check out our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

Check out our 2023 Group Christmas Project HERE

AAA
Avatar
Please consider registering
guest
sp_LogInOut Log Insp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed Topic RSSsp_TopicIcon
Bow Markings
This topic from 2011 is bumped up for further discussion and to provide the information for newer members.
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (2 votes) 
Avatar
Oliver
NC

King
Regulars
March 27, 2011 - 6:08 pm
Member Since: February 28, 2011
Forum Posts: 2439
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Question.

I have never played in a large formal group so bowing direction did not matter.  I do follow the bow articulation markings if given as part of the printed music.
However, I have noticed some of my more experienced friends can pick up some fresh, unmarked, music and play in unison almost without thinking about it.

Is this my imagination or do they know something that I should learn ?

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
March 27, 2011 - 9:24 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 16439

Great question and it's definitely not your imagination.

There are many bowing directions that are standard to use and common sense for experienced players. For example, down beats are usually played with down bows. Accents are usually played with down bows. Diminuendos are often down bows while crescendos are up. Dotted eight followed by a sixteenth are often hooked (slurred). If you end up with an up bow on the next to last note in a measure you often play another up bow to naturally play a down bow on the next measure. The best Bowings enhance musical phrasing.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Oliver
NC

King
Regulars
March 27, 2011 - 10:01 pm
Member Since: February 28, 2011
Forum Posts: 2439
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Well, I find that your PRINT function works and now I can review some past music in a new way :)

 

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
March 28, 2011 - 12:02 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 16439

If anyone has questions about the best or easiest way to bow something, scan it in, save as a PDF or JPEG and mail it to me. I'll happily give suggestions for free if it isn't too much stuff. Smile

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
artoliva
west palm beach

Member
Members
March 28, 2011 - 9:47 pm
Member Since: January 28, 2011
Forum Posts: 6
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hi Pierre, what would be a good arrangement for the wedding march; or entrance and the departure for solo violin? any suggestions? I don't remember the composer for the entrance but when they are leaving it is Mendelssohn i think... 

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
March 29, 2011 - 8:50 am
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 16439

The most common would be Wagner's Wedding March. I will email it to you. Now a days the brides chooses all kinds of fancy interesting pieces. Did you check with the bride?

If you don't mind starting a new topic for this one under either "Playing the violin" or "Breakroom", copy and paste your post, I would appreciate it. I think others might want to ask similar questions and this post could be very useful.

Thanks

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Gordon Shumway
London, England
Members

Regulars
March 3, 2023 - 10:19 am
Member Since: August 1, 2016
Forum Posts: 2455
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It's a big subject, and for beginners, trying to generalise may be more confusing than helpful.

Pierre's words "experienced players" mustn't be taken lightly. There's a lot to it. Some orchestras publish pre-marked parts. The Dulwich Symphony Orchestra used to, but they are tightening up their act. I was going to post a link so you could examine the sort of thing, but that's no longer possible.

Mostly advice concerns double and quadruple time. Pierre's on this is good advice, obviously. But triple and complex time is rarely looked at, and it can be tricky. Sometimes you can get away with down up down, up down up, but other times it has to be down up up, down up up. And the sarabande usually has the second beat stressed, so you might use up down up, up down up

Benjamin Britten can be a law unto himself. But he's pretty good and his stuff is often intelligently marked for you.

And then there's the matter of prosaic bow management/distribution. You might use hooked bowing for that. E.g. in Britten's simple symphony section 2 (see link below - 2nd half of the page) it's best to hook every measure, although Britten doesn't say so explicitly. (and although it's pianissimo, so you aren't going to use much bow anyway).

https://www.all-sheetmusic.com.....7551_3.JPG

Section 3 second measure you're given a helpful upbow mark, then you play the next measure on one down bow, then the next measure has a square bracket over it. That means play the whole measure on one up bow, and so on. Heavy stresses are best played with a downbow, but there's a lot of stuff out there with a heavy stress on the upbow at the tip and you just have to give it the necessary force. Indeed the last two lines call for crescendos on the downbow and diminuendos on the upbow. 

Andrew

Avatar
Mouse
March 3, 2023 - 10:54 am
Member Since: December 26, 2018
Forum Posts: 5448
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online

I thought this discussion would be a good one to bring forward for continued discussion, or just learning from.

I hope this helps with bowing. Any other questions or comments? Please feel free to add more comments and questions.

🐭

The Bumblebee Flies!

Please ignore any typos. My typing ability on a real typewriter did not transfer to these device key pads.

Avatar
Mouse
March 3, 2023 - 11:28 am
Member Since: December 26, 2018
Forum Posts: 5448
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online

What is really weird to me is that when I am playing my violin, viola or cello, I can feel it when I bowed in the wring direction, in a spot where there is definitely a proper direction. It feels clunky, Then I have to figure out how to adjust the bowing direction leading up to that spot. 

Reading Fiddlerman's response in reply #2 has made it a lot clearer, and explains why, at times, I can pick up on it because it just feels unnatural to bow in the direction I am trying or was trying to bow.

Does anyone else have any experiences or tips, based in their experiences, on how to figure out bowing direction?

🐭

The Bumblebee Flies!

Please ignore any typos. My typing ability on a real typewriter did not transfer to these device key pads.

Avatar
Gordon Shumway
London, England
Members

Regulars
March 3, 2023 - 5:15 pm
Member Since: August 1, 2016
Forum Posts: 2455
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I'll have another look at Vocalise sometime, as it's one of those annoying pieces where phrases begin and end mid-measure, their stresses don't coincide with the beat, and Rachmaninov exploits the ambiguity by also having half-measures.

Andrew

Avatar
Mouse
March 3, 2023 - 5:19 pm
Member Since: December 26, 2018
Forum Posts: 5448
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

I love Vocalise! I was doing that on cello when I die lessons. We moved on before I was actually able to do it. It is on my list of things to redo. Maybe that is what I will redo after I am done with the Bourrée. Vocalise was so fun and beautiful. I just had major issues. 

🐭

The Bumblebee Flies!

Please ignore any typos. My typing ability on a real typewriter did not transfer to these device key pads.

Forum Timezone: America/New_York
Most Users Ever Online: 696
Currently Online: Mouse
Guest(s) 131
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming anonkid, KindaScratchy, freesbee, paulinefiddle, Allenph, oneloudmime, MsJoy, Sandybourne, Ripton, Space., loveluach, husseinHr, reedc83, Guido, A. V. Suvorov, Scrap, DennisS, JiminTexas, mcwey, Fashionandfiddle, Giovanni
Top Posters:
ELCBK: 8088
ABitRusty: 4008
Mad_Wed: 2849
Barry: 2690
Fiddlestix: 2647
Gordon Shumway: 2455
Oliver: 2439
DanielB: 2379
Mark: 2177
damfino: 2113
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 3
Members: 31703
Moderators: 0
Admins: 7
Forum Stats:
Groups: 16
Forums: 82
Topics: 10642
Posts: 135007
Newest Members:
alisawilson, justinbrown, joshiburman, jamesmartinjs12, davidmorgan, OliviaErin, pbstrings, nayaghosh, henrykang, anna.byrne80
Administrators: Fiddlerman: 16439, KindaScratchy: 1760, coolpinkone: 4180, BillyG: 3744, MrsFiddlerman: 2, Jimmie Bjorling: 0, Mouse: 5448