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How can one learn to sing every note when playing violin, without petting it?
I feel in many difficult pieces I can play, but not sing the phrase or the notes.
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How much experience do you have singing? And are you trying to learn to sing the piece by sight or by ear?
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Hello anathama,
When it comes to singing without violin, I have no experience at all, and I am really dreadful with it 
I am always trying to phrase by ear...
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leiasverker said:
Hello anathama,
When it comes to singing without violin, I have no experience at all, and I am really dreadful with it
I am always trying to phrase by ear...
Well then. I think you should practice singing vocal music in the shower/car more, to help yourself get more comfortable with it. Realize that your playing ability can easily exceed your singing ability, and that singing while playing an instrument is already difficult for people with singing experience. Play simpler pieces that stay within your comfortable vocal range and work on getting your voice to perform them better.
Remember, the voice is another fretless instrument! If your biggest problem is singing in tune, try to play single notes on your violin (or anything else) and hitting them exactly. Practice doing that. Sing scales. This site has some good ideas: http://www.voiceofyourlife.com.....0Tune.html
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OK, that is actually a great question. You need to learn to feel the phrase as though you are saying it or singing it while playing. The violin should breathe with you. You need to become the violin and not let it decide over you. It's actually a great idea to sing the phrases beforehand and imitate it with your fiddle. Many people, even soloists, sing while playing. Not loudly and sometimes quite ugly but they are so much into the music, as apposed to the technique that they don't even notice that they are singing.
Too much petting means that you are actually breaking up the phrase and not tying the notes together as is sometimes necessary when building a phrase. Another way to learn to phrase is to listen to a lot of music played by great musicians.
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
What does too much "petting" mean?
I have been singing, a lot, to my daughter since she was born. Interestingly, she has never repeated any songs I sang to her except twinkle twinkle little star and ABCs (which are the same tune). The first time she sang twinkle twinkle little star I did not recognize it at all, because she sang it in a totally different tune.
In addition, she has been listening to music since birth, and listening to musical stories, and watching musical movies a lot since she started to show interest in these. She could recognize a tune she has heard before.
Lately, she has been interested in listening to The Magic Tree House -- King Arthur. There were a couple songs that we love, so we will sing together. She remembers all the lyrics and I remember the tune. When we sang together, she sang as if she was harmonizing for me.
Someone at work told me some kids could be tone deaf. Is she one?
And, if she is one, how would this affect her in playing violin?
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That is an interesting question. I don't think she is tone deaf. I don't think everyone is born knowing how to sing. Perhaps very excellent singers are, but the majority of us kind of pick it up as we go along. My son does not sing very well, but he has pretty good intonation on his violin. He adjusts his fingers quickly when he is off. He just turned seven a few weeks ago.
My daughter and I used to belt out "What would I do without you?" from the Magic Tree House. She was like two at the time! She LOVED that song!!! And she picked it up quicker than twinkle twinkle. And that song was much more complex!!
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Pky said:
What does too much "petting" mean?
Petting for me is when a person pets each and every note by starting and ending the note with a crescendo and diminuendo. Opposite of harsh attacks. If used too much can be the equivilant of sea sickness with music.
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
Well, lately I encouraged my daughter to sing along with me while I sing, her singing was either "harmonizing" my voice or flat. I also had her try on the Fiddlerman's intonation games, the beginner level. She could tell if the fiddlerman and the girl are playing the same note, too high, or too low. However, if I have her repeats what I sing, it is almost always off tune. After all the "testing" I decided that she could tell the difference of notes but she can't reproduce it with her own voice. I guessed that's why she could recognize music pieces that she has heard before. I just hope that this is developmental, and with practice she will get better.
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That is interesting Pky. She can recognize the difference but has a more difficult time hearing herself. I think that she will be fine if she can learn not just to listen but to hear herself as well. Maybe her concentration is going towards what she is doing (singing) instead of focusing on the pitch.
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
Fiddlerman,
The way you put it - she can't hear herself is interesting and very observent. Thanks! It really helps me find out what's going on with her voice.
It makes sense to me now. She loves to sing and always makes up her own songs. She could switch the lyrics in a song around age two. I strong agree with you that she concentrates more on her own singing instead of focusing on the pitch.
I am trying to encourage her to sing along with me and sing while she play her violin, maybe that will help her hear her own voice but I don't want to overdo it so she would be too self-concious about it and refuses to sing.
One thing I have been wondering about is: she was premature for two months, she seemed to have hearing problem at one point before she turned one, then it seemed fine. In addition, she never babbled like other babies either -- no mama, dada sound or the likes. She could never scream or squeal like her peers either. She would try till her voice got hoarse. Therefore, I assumed she has some kind of difficulties to produce pitches that she wants to produce.
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How about playing a similar game with the violin?
You play or sing a note and she imitates it. Would be interesting to see if she can hear it better on the fiddle.
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
Thanks for your suggestion. I will try that. I don't have a violin and I'm not confident that i could play the note right. I probably could try it with piano, but our piano is probably out of tune 
. Any way, she just started to play and sing a long with it, it seemed like she got A & E right. I'm not sure about G & D. I will keep trying. I kind of mentioned my concern to her teacher as well (I didn't want to talk about it right in front of my daughter, she is already very self concious). She said playing violin will help her to sing better. I guess she meant with practice with violin (single tone) would help her hear better and sing better.
By the way, would piano not as good as violin since it is not mono tone (I don't know if I'm using a correct term here)? because each key has two or three strings, when each key is struck, all the strings vibrate together to produce the sound, so if i use piano, she might hear more than one sound and could decide what to repeat?
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Well, all 3 piano strings are meant to play together in tune, so I don't think you should worry, but the problem is in the fact that the piano may be out of tune.
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Well the Piano will work too but she may have a hard time comparing her tone to the different tambour that the Piano has. In any case, I think that you should definitely try it.
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
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