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The Red Fiddle
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Sofia Leo
Springfield, Oregon

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December 2, 2011 - 2:52 pm
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Before gluing the top on, the FF holes needed some color. Now, the traditional way is to paint on the ground, the varnish, etc. and then add color to highlight whatever you want to highlight. The main problem I see with that is it's really easy to dribble paint/varnish down into the body of the fiddle through the FFs, and that is just ugly, IMHO. Painting from the underside of the top seemed like a really simple way to make a neat and accurate job of it -

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This is an acrylic craft paint that past use tells me won't soak into the wood so any "overspray" can be easily and completely sanded off with no trouble. It is thick enough to stand up and not run all over the work. The color is mostly black with enough burnt umber mixed in to keep it from looking like a cheap VSO (I hope.)

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There is a small pressure ding at the arrow above that I can't decide what to do about. On the one hand, I could try to steam it out (too deep for scraping or sanding, and it was obviously put there by a sharp knock with something fairly hard. It came out of the box with this blemish.) OTOH, it could be left alone and with some creative "antiquing" made to look like an old injury. What say you?

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The gray/brown color was so nice on the FFs that I painted the inside of the pegbox as well. The paint is still wet in the pictures, so it looks lumpy but isn't. It's really hard to get varnish down into the pegbox, and it really doesn't need it, but a little color makes it recede and the scroll stand out more.

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I like it! The scroll outline and corner details will be left until after the varnish is on. Corner and lining details coming up! And then the top goes on, maybe this evening if I can get some other chores taken care of...

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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Fiddlerman
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December 2, 2011 - 2:54 pm
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CatMcCall said:

.......Should see if I can get a pic with the light showing through the top before the box is closed...

That would be very nice. I just bought a macro lens for my video from Amazon last week. Would have been nice for doing just that. Actually bought a wide angle lens that has the macro attached to it. Sometimes I noticed that I can't get enough of my arms and hands in some of my videos from the distance I have to work with. Should be able to make better videos now. cool

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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December 2, 2011 - 3:31 pm
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I would try to steam it a bit.  Just take a dampened cloth, lay it over the spot and use a hot iron on it.  It should raise it very easily.  You know if you don't try you will always look just at that spot where others would never notice it.

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Fiddlerman
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December 3, 2011 - 12:04 am
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I used to put big drops of water on my wooden floor in Sweden whenever there we dropped stuff on it and creating dings. In the morning the floor had soaked up the water and expanded back to normal. If it works, it would be an easy fix.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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Sofia Leo
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Kevin M. said:

You know if you don't try you will always look just at that spot where others would never notice it.

You're totally right, Kevin, and I realized that as soon as the words were out of my mouth, so to speak smile Here's what I did:

A close-up of the dent -

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In size, it's about 3/8" long, and 1/16" deep with smooth edges, no broken grain lines.

I used a wet, folded paper towel and a soldering iron (wish I had bookmarked that link,) figuring that my big sewing iron would be awkward to use and would leak hot water where it wasn't needed.

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Gentle taps over the dent with the soldering iron produced a hiss of steam and results very quickly with not much water on the rest of the top.

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The end result was a raised spot where the dent had been. Surprising, until I remembered that the dent had not been scraped - duh! it was sunk lower than the rest of the face drooling

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A bit of gentle scraping after it was dry and the dent has totally disappeared! Amazing, really. Much more troubling is the yellow-ish shadow around the edges that only shows up in photographs. There is obviously a very thin remnant of glue that needs to be scraped some more...

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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December 3, 2011 - 3:14 pm
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Excellent jobthumbs-up

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Sofia Leo
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December 3, 2011 - 3:51 pm
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Okay, let's take a detailed look at the corners. The SFF kit had really good, snugly fitting corners. The Red Fiddle corners are not so neatly done, which has given me some anxiety. Upper bass corner:

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Not bad, but not very well fitted to the ribs. Outside mold maybe? Lower bass corner -

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Lots of glue residue, even worse fit, but everything is tight, no loose wood bits.

Upper treble, the most troubling corner -

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There's quite a gap where the block should meet the ribs. The linings end behind the block, accounting for the poor fit of the block. This is what the outside of this corner looks like -

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That gap extends into the inside, behind the block, showing that the fit is not good at all. More on this corner in a bit. Lower treble corner -

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Better fit than the upper corner. Note the rough cut linings, top and bottom. They are quite thick and not tapered much.

I had thought to purchase some maple rib stock and construct an outside mold and rebuild the garland, but the bottom would not come off - it would appear that what I thought was hide glue is really something else that isn't water soluble and so an Artful Dodge is in order.

After much research, the consensus is that some really great historical fiddles don't even have corner blocks; carving out bad existing blocks is a messy, bad idea; cutting the back off the garland would likely lead to more problems than it would solve; so long as nothing is loose, leaving things as they are is not a bad idea; and there are easy ways to close gaps that will hold for a long time without compromising the sound. Enter a modern* glue -

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I neglected to bookmark the site where this advice was found, but a reputable builder/restorer uses this technique to repair and reinforce fiddles that have no (or inadequate) corner blocks where a more detailed restoration would be cost prohibitive. Painter's tape on the outside to keep the glue from dribbling all over. Glue is slowly squeezed into the gap behind the block on the inside and then the fiddle is left standing up until the glue is dry. This glue dries the same color as the wood, but I'll be highlighting the rib joins with black paint, so this repair won't show. The gap is closed, but the pictures are crap, so you'll just have to believe...

* This particular brand and type of glue was recommended for this particular repair because it dries and stays somewhat soft, providing a bit of "cushion" to delicate corners. Hide glue, OTOH, dries bone dry and harder than the wood it holds together, which is why it's superior to modern glues for instruments that vibrate - the hardness of the dried glue lets the instrument vibrate in harmony, while modern glues dry soft, allowing for vibrations that can be inconsistent and inharmonious.

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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Sofia Leo
Springfield, Oregon

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December 3, 2011 - 3:58 pm
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Last one today! The rib linings were quite thick and square, not tapered as the best instruments will be. The upper linings were easy to trim with a knife, the lower with some fairly rough sandpaper -

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Nice and neat and much more consistent. The linings taper from full width where the top will be glued on to nothing at all where they blend with the ribs.

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The bottom linings don't have quite as nice a taper, but still miles better than before. The label is glued in, so now I'm committed to getting this fiddle finished in 2011 smile

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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SaraO
Michigan

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December 3, 2011 - 5:40 pm
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Love the updates, Cat. The fiddle is lookin' good!

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Fiddlerman
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December 3, 2011 - 7:09 pm
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I ditto what SaraO said,

MGN is lucky. thumbs-up

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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When I have the edge of a corner bout that is slightly open sometimes you can just heat it up and melt the glue then use clothes pinds with rubber bands to close the gap.  The tightbond glue works very well and I also use it in places where I don't expect to ever have to take something apart.  As for the corner blocks, I have run into a violin where there were no corner blocks and to my surprise the corners were about the only thing that didn't fall apart on that violin.  Are the linings already glued in when you get the kit?  A lot of violins are made where the linings go slightly behind the corner blocks and the best ones are made where they are fitted into the blocks.  Keep up the good work.

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Sofia Leo
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Kevin M. said:

When I have the edge of a corner bout that is slightly open sometimes you can just heat it up and melt the glue then use clothes pinds with rubber bands to close the gap.  The tightbond glue works very well and I also use it in places where I don't expect to ever have to take something apart.  As for the corner blocks, I have run into a violin where there were no corner blocks and to my surprise the corners were about the only thing that didn't fall apart on that violin.  Are the linings already glued in when you get the kit?  A lot of violins are made where the linings go slightly behind the corner blocks and the best ones are made where they are fitted into the blocks.  Keep up the good work.

The corner was more than slightly open - the joint is crooked and there's no way the gap could have been closed without some kind of miracle. The linings were already glued in and not set into the corner blocks like you describe, but extending behind the blocks. Not very neat, but very secure.

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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Sofia Leo
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SaraO and Fiddlerman said:

Love the updates, Cat. The fiddle is lookin' good!

I ditto what SaraO said,

MGN is lucky. thumbs-up

Thank you for your kind words! cheers

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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BCShalom
Seattle, WA

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December 4, 2011 - 1:53 pm
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Beautiful, just beautiful~What a beautiful fiddle!!!

 

Shalom Shalom clap

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BCShalom
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Well CatMcall, it is time to begin from the beginning, well as close as I want to get to the b3eginning, my Stewart-MacDonald Fiddle kit was my Chanukkah gift from my Bride.

Awwww, she doesn't know what it will take to build yet, Oy.

Anyway I am ready to begin as soon as I get some Tools, well the tools I need.

What tools did you say you used, simple hand tools, what about Graduating the plates and Such?  I know there was a post about building a gauge for the finger board, Sorry I forgot who posted it.  I can see his face and I did print it all out.

I don't know where to begin.... LOL.

I just hope I can do a half way decent job on this fiddle.

Anyway I will be printing out all of your stuff and be looking for graduation charts online.

 

Thanks Cat for getting me started.

 

I can't wait to try it out.

 

Shalom Shalom serenadeviolin-studentviolintongue

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Fiddlerman
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December 22, 2011 - 9:34 am
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I'm so happy to see you actually doing what you talked about doing Shalom. One of my distributors is http://howardcore.com/ and they sell luthier tools. Check it out when you get a chance. They don't sell instruments, strings and accessories to consumers but I believe they sell the luthier tools to everyone.
Besides all my gigs I spend many hours a day working on a feed for fiddlershop.com
Already have around 5000 products (you can't see them yet as I have to upload the feed but it's not ready yet) plus I need to find match, upload, and in some cases, hunt down pictures for all the products. MONKEY work I tell you.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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Sofia Leo
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December 22, 2011 - 12:52 pm
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Congrats, BCShalom!dancinbunny You've got a keeper there, for sure! You're gonna have so much fun! Maybe your lovely wife will decide to join you when she sees the results...

I posted about the basic tools you'll need earlier in this thread and Stew-Mac has a tool list you can download for free on their fiddle kit page. Don't get too crazy with the high priced specialized tools - you can make many of the tools (spool clamps are insanely expensive for what they are, for instance, but I posted a cheap way to make your own on my fiddle blog) or use an unconventional tool that you might have laying around.

There are a gazillion graduation diagrams online and even more arguments for various patterns. You can get lost there if you're not careful. A thickness gauge can be hacked together (let me know if you want some links to people who have built similar items. There are many that are prettier, but we go for functional around here :-) for much less than the retail of $150 + if you're so inclined.

Scrapers are indispensable - scraping goes so much faster than sanding and doesn't produce nearly the dust. Looks great, too! The ones you can buy are generally too thick and not flexible enough, nor are they generally shaped for violin scraping. I made mine and have plenty of shim stock left over if you would like me to send you some. You do need a pair of tin snips to cut it and a small file to shape the edges. Whether or not you bevel the edges is up to you - plans for a jig (don't have mine made yet) can be found here, along with lots of other good stuff. Let me know if that link doesn't work for you - they want you to sign up for their weekly e-newsletter but I saved the .pdf file and can send it to you.

You'll need a good, sharp 1/2" flat chisel to carve the neck mortise. A finger plane for cutting down the purfling is nice, but you can use a 1/4" or 1/2" gouge for the same purpose AND for cutting the channel and save a few bucks.

I could go on and on smile Start a new thread for your project and ask any questions as they come up. I've got a lot of links that can be added as you progress as a database for others who want to have a go. Kevin's bridge fitting tutorial and the related soundpost discussion can't be beat.

Still working on the Red Fiddle, but the weather is just too cold here for spending any time in the Shop. Today's project is to get an old Kay cello set up to see if it plays after being carted here and there for 30 years as a piece of decor by the OH. He's out of town on a boat related expedition (like we need another!) and I hope to have it set up by the time he gets back. Anyone interested in hearing that story? Why, yes, we are insane around here dazed

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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Sofia Leo
Springfield, Oregon

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December 22, 2011 - 1:01 pm
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I'm looking forward to seeing the Fiddlerman shop. 5000 products! Sounds like it will be a one-stop shop dancinbunny

Mary in Springfield, Oregon http://www.thefiddleandbanjopr.....dpress.com

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Fiddlerman
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December 22, 2011 - 5:25 pm
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Well, I hope it will be a one stop shop but it'll take a while. I'll work with you guys on price and be honest when I can't beat them. Unfortunately sometimes the only way you can have the best price is to buy things in bulk and I can't do that at this point. I'm amazed in some cases how little the margins are. There are a few products that I have found that I must pay more for than what some shops are selling them for online. I am making comparisons and finding out what other distributors sell the same product and find often that I have the best. I am baffled. Anyway. I'll buy some products in bulk and discount them to be competitive. It's just going to take time, and I am not the most patient person in the world. LOL

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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myguitarnow
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Yay clap...Looking good Cat! I can't wait! Hope it warms up enough up there so you can finish. It's been in the 70s and 80s down here. cool

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