Welcome to our forum. A Message To Our New and Prospective Members . Check out our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.
Private messaging is working again.

AAA
Avatar
Please consider registering
guest
sp_LogInOut Log Insp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed Topic RSSsp_TopicIcon
Reading complex music sheets
Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 Topic Rating: 0 (0 votes) 
Avatar
al_th

Advanced member
Members
January 25, 2012 - 12:27 pm
Member Since: January 22, 2012
Forum Posts: 55
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hello !

 

Here will be my first question on this forum. Please not that it is just the beginning of a rainbow, a tempest of question coming. But let start with this one !

 

When i was young, i learned a bit music theory. I can read notes very slowly ( let say that 80 bpm is a high average of what i am able to read without having any problem (maybe i am a little bit optimistic, but i am working on it.)

The youtube video which bringed this question in my mind was :

feature=related

I obviously now that it is not a beginner piece, and i am completely okay with this. But i came with a question. When looking to a sheet of music like this, do the player read while he is playing. Or does the player read before, learn some parts which are difficult to read, and when playing, just look at the sheet to keep the good temp, the good accentuation, the good accents, and to know where he is ?

 

I hardly see myself reading this kind of sheet of music, even in 20 years (actually, read 1 note at a 80 bpm tempo is already hard, what should i say with a 130/140 bmp tempo with 3 notes each beats...)

Thank you for your time !

 

alex.

Avatar
Guest
Guests
January 25, 2012 - 1:15 pm

I can play this...Just have to click on the Arrow and it plays roflol

 

I wouldn't know where to start to answer your question.  I find it hard to believe that someone could just play this without learning it first.  Maybe not completely memorize it but memorize the patterns.

Avatar
Aleive
Northern Norway

Regular advisor
Members

Regulars
January 25, 2012 - 2:12 pm
Member Since: January 21, 2012
Forum Posts: 121
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

A friend of mine (That actually can read notes) says that the way he does it. Is that he practices really hard on the entire piece. So that he more or less know it by heart. So that when he sees the segment, he knows what to play.. 

Reading advanced notes consists of several stages, among them are

Analyzing. This is where you slowly and thoroughly go through the piece, reading note for note, visualizing every key.

Practicing. Often you practice a segment at a time. Possibly at half speed or something like that. Until you get a hang of it. 

Memorizing. This is where you try to stand on your own feet. A good analogy would be that someone holding a speech sounds way more sincere, and a lot better if he can talk without reading.. Just using the notes, the general look of the notes as keywords that reminds you of what to play :)

 

This works for him, and everyone he knows. 

As a sidenote this process is entirely dependant on your willingness to practice like a mad horse. It yields good results though.

"Art, as far as it is able, follows nature, as a pupil imitates his master; thus your art must be, as it were, God's grandchild."

Avatar
Gail
29 Palms, CA

Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
January 25, 2012 - 2:31 pm
Member Since: December 9, 2011
Forum Posts: 221
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It seems to me that there were some unwritten pauses in there.  Just saying...

 

devil-violin

I've learned so much from my mistakes that I've decided to make some more.

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
January 25, 2012 - 2:34 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 16537

This is too advanced for anyone to read. What we do is work on it from start to finish real slowly. Not all parts have to be played that slowly at once but most of them on Paganini. Some pros have and will never be able to play Paganini.
In THIS case it is not so much the speed but more the acrobatics involved in playing this. Stretches, chords, etc.
Generally we have the music to pieces like this so that we don't get a memory slip. If I perform Paganini I like to do it without music. It takes me a few weeks of intensive practicing to prepare something like this. I've only really played about half of the Caprices because they are so difficult and we don't get that many opportunities to perform them. A lot of sheet music that you may consider difficult, I can read and play in tempo and often not miss a note.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Avatar
Gail
29 Palms, CA

Honorary advisor
Members

Regulars
January 25, 2012 - 3:20 pm
Member Since: December 9, 2011
Forum Posts: 221
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I knew you could do it!  Anyone who can play this deserves a standing O.

birthday_balloon

I've learned so much from my mistakes that I've decided to make some more.

Avatar
Guest
Guests
January 25, 2012 - 3:50 pm

LOL! rofl /tries to count 6 extralines above.. counting with fingers...D? drooling/

How one can read it duncecapduncecap? It's much easier to learn... I can't play with music sheet anyway...

SDC13822.jpgImage Enlarger

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Mustang
Minnesnowda

Regular advisor
Members

Regulars
January 25, 2012 - 3:58 pm
Member Since: August 27, 2011
Forum Posts: 178
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

64th notes... dazed

Avatar
al_th

Advanced member
Members
January 25, 2012 - 4:04 pm
Member Since: January 22, 2012
Forum Posts: 55
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Mad_Wed said

LOL! rofl /tries to count 6 extralines above.. counting with fingers...D? drooling/

How one can read it duncecapduncecap? It's much easier to learn... I can't play with music sheet anyway...

SDC13822.jpgImage Enlarger

You told me that this forum was fun, this is one more proof :D
Really liked this one !

@everyone : Thank you for your answers, i begin to understand the process of playing music with music sheets now... (I had music theory lectures, but we never applied what we have learned to the violin lecture i had, in my memory at least. It has been a long time but i never understood how good musicians were doing it)

As i did not receive my instrument yet i try to use my time struggling with music sheets again, it's difficult and painful but it might help later ! 

Avatar
QuicheLoraine
Nashville, TN

Advanced member
Members
January 27, 2012 - 8:41 pm
Member Since: November 12, 2011
Forum Posts: 84
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Don't you just love those dog-whistle-range octave notes? Lol! Some of those way-the-heck-up-there notes are not instantly recognized by ear or sight alone, but going through fingering positions and counting notes up the scale- we would often write the letter value for them on the music in Youth Symphony for a frame of reference. And those lightning fast notes...36th, no, 64th???...notes. Yeah, no one could learn this by ear alone because no one could possibly hear all of those notes that fast. What Pierre said was our approach in Youth Symphony with some of the more complex pieces....or more realistically, a few people had those down pat, and the rest played air violin- ha!

 

Can you imagine if they had a "follow the bouncing ball" video (like Karaoke) following the notes while the tune played? That ball would be a zig zag streak.  

 

        

Avatar
TerryT
Coleshill, Warwickshire
Members

Regulars
January 28, 2012 - 4:32 am
Member Since: December 15, 2011
Forum Posts: 1731
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

Big WOW!
I'm just chuffed that I was able to follow the music while it was being played.
But tbf, those tram-lines helped.

I guess if you break it down into manageable chunks rather that getting blinded by the whole page, it helps. (just like many challenges we face in life today)
serenade

I am amazed at how old people of my age are.....

Avatar
Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
January 28, 2012 - 3:54 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
Forum Posts: 16537
12sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

True. Baby steps.

When I learn something like a Paganini Caprice I take down the tempo considerably to get the acrobatics of the piece in place properly before stepping up the tempo.

thumbs-up

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

Forum Timezone: America/New_York
Most Users Ever Online: 696
Currently Online: Gordon Shumway
Guest(s) 240
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today celeigh87
Upcoming fryserisnon8, Picklefish, Tammy, Shell, Schaick, GlassTownCur, Violinista Italiano, Ogre, marcnaz, VirginViolinist, Cearbhael, eugenephilip572
Top Posters:
ELCBK: 8834
ABitRusty: 4303
Mad_Wed: 2849
Gordon Shumway: 2733
Barry: 2690
Fiddlestix: 2647
Oliver: 2439
DanielB: 2379
stringy: 2371
Mark: 2273
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 3
Members: 31781
Moderators: 0
Admins: 8
Forum Stats:
Groups: 16
Forums: 84
Topics: 10860
Posts: 138009
Newest Members:
jeni2024, Goldenbow, joanie, hunmari01, lydia.vertu SP, Thavence SP, tcaron21, Ustiana SP, DennisRathbone SP, Dan
Administrators: Fiddlerman: 16537, KindaScratchy: 1760, coolpinkone: 4180, BillyG: 3746, JoakimSimplePress: 0, MrsFiddlerman: 2, Jimmie Bjorling: 0, Mouse: 6097