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Nobody cares if you are the best Mozart (or whomever) interpreter. Nobody wants you to create something new. If you are as capable at sight reading (more or less an IQ test) as anyone else, you should be on the swag from the central bank. I think most people outside of the corruption loop will be forcibly retired at age 60. When the plutocrats ask "why should I give you a SS retirement check"....answer: "Because my violin sight reading proves i'm a real intellectual, not a pseudo like you".
Anyways, I don't think anyone can make an economic argument for learning classical violin at any age. The business of classical violin is basically a ponzi system. Then again, so is the entire financial system as long as the fool taxpayer is on the hook for all the losses. Classical violin sums up the world very nicely...don't do anything useful except be an elitist. Unlike Wall Street, no phd required.
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not so sure about all that, but my reason for learning anything is because I choose to. If I am financially rewarded for my work, all the better
There is no shame in playing twinkle, youre playing Mozart
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Barry said
not so sure about all that, but my reason for learning anything is because I choose to. If I am financially rewarded for my work, all the better
C'mon, Barry...you posted that Vengerov masterclass video. I saw some massive disappointment etched on faces there...the older female on the brink of tears stating she was going to join a string quartet. The older gentleman basically getting back into violin because he found it fun. Not very convincing at all.
They expected to be tenured soloists. Who cares if nobody shows up at the concert hall, the whole thing was supposed to be about joining the club. Can't blame them after all that work. I thought the whole video was pretty abusive BTW.
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Playing music isn't something I do with money as a prime motivation. I play because I love playing. If I also happen to get paid for it, that's cool. If I don't, I play anyway.
Seeing one's self as an intellectual and seeing someone else as being "pseudo" is also elitism. It is human nature to try to be better than others and to feed the ego by it. We get more done with that tendency than we would without it.
Just sayin'..
"This young wine may have a lot of tannins now, but in 5 or 10 years it is going to be spectacular, despite the fact that right now it tastes like crude oil. You know this is how it is supposed to taste at this stage of development." ~ Itzhak Perlman
@ Composer: Where are you coming up with all these defeatist attitude topic's?
You seem to be having a problem with trying to discourage people from doing what they love and want to be semi-successfull. You are posting negative's all over thhis site.
Knock it off please. 
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Composer said
Nobody cares if you are the best Mozart (or whomever) interpreter. Nobody wants you to create something new.I think this is true. Nobody really cares if you fail at everything in life and become a bum who lives in a cardboard box. So what do most people care about? They care about success, they want to celebrate it. Thats why there are stars and papparazi. When Itzak or Perlman play, the audience cheers for their success. I play the violin because I care, not because of what others think.
If you are as capable at sight reading (more or less an IQ test) as anyone else, you should be on the swag from the central bank. I think most people outside of the corruption loop will be forcibly retired at age 60. When the plutocrats ask "why should I give you a SS retirement check"....answer: "Because my violin sight reading proves i'm a real intellectual, not a pseudo like you".
You might need a counselor to help you with this one. I found my ability to sight read has crippled my ability to really learn to train my ear. Like a crutch. I sight read like Einstein develops theorys.
Anyways, I don't think anyone can make an economic argument for learning classical violin at any age. The business of classical violin is basically a ponzi system. Then again, so is the entire financial system as long as the fool taxpayer is on the hook for all the losses. Classical violin sums up the world very nicely...don't do anything useful except be an elitist. Unlike Wall Street, no phd required.
When asked by his fellow inmates regarding locking himself in the wardens office and playing the classical music why he did it? Andy Duphrene simply said "Hope". That classical music reminds us that there is something magically beautiful out there that they cant take away from us. Something outside the concrete walls. - So, thats why classical has stayed with us, it gives us hope outside our dreary lives that there is something outthere worth persuing for our own edification.
"Please play some wrong notes, so that we know that you are human" - said to Jascha Heifetz.
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Fiddlestix is right. We need to think positively to avoid discouragement. The whole idea of talking about playing and working at learning to play the violin is to get good ideas, tips and encouragement. Perhaps if you were to talk about what you like to work on and what helps your improvement you would enjoy the fiddle a little more.
I'm kind of curious if you (composer) enjoy playing the violin or if you do it for another reason?
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
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Fiddlestix said
@ Composer: Where are you coming up with all these defeatist attitude topic's?You seem to be having a problem with trying to discourage people from doing what they love and want to be semi-successfull. You are posting negative's all over thhis site.
Knock it off please.
+1 on that! 
"If you practice with your hands you must practice all day. Practice with your mind and you can accomplish the same amount in minutes." Nathan Milstein
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I am with you cdennyb. That was my first impression upon reading Composer's posts and it got more and more irritated. Thanks for the words about his negative postings.
We are here learning and encouraging each other, with support and help if possible. There is no need for negativity, too many around already.
ratvn said
I am with you cdennyb. That was my first impression upon reading Composer's posts and it got more and more irritated. Thanks for the words about his negative postings.We are here learning and encouraging each other, with support and help if possible. There is no need for negativity, too many around already.
cdennyb didn't say that,, I did.
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I am so sorry, Fiddlestix. I did not read it carefully. My sincere apology to you.
So I should say that I with you, right. I like to express my opinion upon first reading the post, but I do have problem with wording correctly, haha...so thank you for saying it though.
Best Regards,
Robert
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I don't really think a person who just playing the violin for the money, will ever get so far as a person who love and are passionate about music and the instrument. A man can do everything by the book, but if its not by heart, it wouldn't touch many people.
'Armed with theory, practice becomes meaningful. Through practice, theory becomes fulfilled.' - Egon von Neindorff.
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HatefulPain said
I don't really think a person who just playing the violin for the money, will ever get so far as a person who love and are passionate about music and the instrument. A man can do everything by the book, but if its not by heart, it wouldn't touch many people.
I agree and think that goes for anything in life. I personally know a couple people who have went to school and choose professions strictly for the money and hate their jobs.
quite different if you HAVE to take a certain job to earn a living vs something you choose to learn and hate
There is no shame in playing twinkle, youre playing Mozart
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Agreed. I don't feel that just the possibility of making money is a good reason to go into music of any sort. There are far more dependable careers that would be more likely to show a good return for less time and work than it takes to learn music on any instrument.
"This young wine may have a lot of tannins now, but in 5 or 10 years it is going to be spectacular, despite the fact that right now it tastes like crude oil. You know this is how it is supposed to taste at this stage of development." ~ Itzhak Perlman
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Composer said
Anyways, I don't think anyone can make an economic argument for learning classical violin at any age.
What about for well-being and health? With Alzheimer studies, it has been proven that the more we use our brains in age, the better chance we have at fighting the mental decline caused by this horrible disease.
There have also been studies on the effect playing classical music has on our mental and physical health. It helps with our abilities to focus, task manage, memory, situational awareness and lets not forget, lower blood pressure, stress and heart rates.
Economically, that saves us thousands of dollars on medical expenses.
Plus, learning classical helps build a foundation in technique that we can always fall back on and helps us learn new material. I like to think of it as a history lesson of music through violin as we can see the influence classical music has on the songs we listen to and play today.
I play because I love music and the violin. Not to make money or make a future out of it. And, I am thankful that I have had classical training (with other instruments) as it it something I enjoy and has been very beneficial in my life.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” ~Benjamin Franklin
LOL!
I liked this one:
When the plutocrats ask "why should I give you a SS retirement check"….answer: "Because my violin sight reading proves i'm a real intellectual, not a pseudo like you".
Nice sense of humor, Composer... well, if it was a humor =)
Actually not everything THAT bad =) If You can play good on any instrument - You'll never be hungry. I know several street musicians, who seriously make money for living by playing guitars on the streets and even rising a child on those money! Of course, it's not something that an ambitious musician dreams about, but this is the other way to make money on music.
You are too melancholic about this! =)
I don't even think about making money with my playing, my reasons are love and passion. I think that learning is a great period of the whole thing, when You have something to tell and can't express your thoughts properly... and you searching those ways "how to"! It's fascinating!
"Only reason for adult to begin learning classical violin"
????????????????????????????????????????????
There's no such thing =)
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I personally love composers posts.
As an intelligent chap, I love to have my mind and ideals challenged and questioned.
It's true, I use my intellect to understand why a violin does what it does, how do harmonics work, what frequency is what note equivalent, why can I only play double stops when I'm trying to play single notes etc and many more etceteras.
So my classical studies could be elitist tendencies, and my folky blues could be the result of too much brandy.
But I love playing my violin for one main reason! Because I love playing my violin.
And when my intellect is too tired to work out the answers, I pick up my bow and my violin sings. It never stops me from making music coz I don't know the theory, whether I am attempting Mozart or Motown.
I am amazed at how old people of my age are.....
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