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Potential Silver Wire Bow Wrapping Machine
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Irv
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October 22, 2018 - 9:27 pm
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I am looking at a variety of simple machines used in the basement bamboo rod making group, and came up with something that would really make quick work of wrapping silver wire on a violin bow.  The great thing about it is that the bow (which has a camber) remains in a fixed position.  It is called a JW Rod Wrapper.  It looks like the wrap advancement uses a bicycle threaded headset.5E66EEA4-A366-4F42-BE3F-6B0DEE463593.jpeg

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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steveduf
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October 23, 2018 - 8:17 pm
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Irv

funny you should post this

this is my machine for wrapping windings on fishing rods.  I will try this some day .  It uses a sewing machine motor (which has variable speed foot control)

it uses a rubber lined chuck to hold the rod.  I was going to use silk and nylon winding when I wanted to keep the weight down for balance.  I have a ton of windings including metallics030E045B-B19A-4B6F-BAE2-BDDEE28B0255.jpegImage Enlarger974A023A-5424-459F-B153-04AA3660054D.jpegImage Enlarger8D7F73D3-AA0A-44A6-BFB3-75AD4C3996D7.jpegImage EnlargerE1F68FCF-1D2D-4F5E-8DDF-C1D8AEE212B7.jpegImage Enlarger.

i have way to many hobbies 

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steveduf
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October 23, 2018 - 9:12 pm
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Some of the thread windings on rods are quite detailed and artistic387D0576-CB6F-47DF-9246-57F211B8A4D6.jpegImage Enlarger

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Irv
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October 23, 2018 - 9:55 pm
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Hi steveduf.  I wrongly assumed that the winding was advanced by the bicycle headstock thread.  The string exits the machine through a thin piece of rod with an end hoop.  Rod tension keeps the thread on course.

There is a technique in bamboo rod repair of using white silk thread to cover a splice, which becomes transparent once varnish is applied.  The same thread can be used to lend the appearance that the guides are suspended without any support.

I did find a bamboo rod maker named Divine that made octagonal sections, but the industry did not follow his example.

I found gold and silver plated copper wire at a very attractive price on eBay, and I think that rose gold plated wire would look even better if I can find it.  

I see how your winder can be successful on a rod, which is cylindrical in shape, but it would be difficult on a violin bow.   Although people do it with a hand operated drill.

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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Irv
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October 24, 2018 - 8:55 am
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The two brands of silk thread that I have found are Tire and YLI.  Tire seems to have nicer colors (although I am color blind).  Do you have any experience with either?

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
October 26, 2018 - 3:16 pm
Member Since: September 26, 2010
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Very cool Irv. My luthiers would rather not use a machine. I'm like you though. They say that the machine can't do as good a job as they can by hand...

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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Irv
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October 26, 2018 - 5:00 pm
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I worked out that the handle is operated by the bearing races and shaft of a bicycle pedal.  I had to purchase a set of 9/16” 20 thread per inch taps since no one that I could find makes a right (and left) handed nut with this pitch.  I determined that the pedal shaft housing need to be 3/4” schedule 80 to get the necessary O.D. and I.D.  The main shaft needs to be 1-1/4” schedule 80.

Ordering the stuff I need to make a couple (hopefully I will be able to sell one to make up the cost for the pair).

Fiddlerman, once completed I am willing to send you a sample so you could compare the work of the machine to that of your luthiers.  What gauge wire do you like to work with (I assume about 26 gauge).  I did find a source of rose gold (over silver) plated wire.  Should be a looker.

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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damfino
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October 26, 2018 - 6:57 pm
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This is my local luthier with the winder he designed

11696410_954361127949075_6369694710204666570_o.jpgImage Enlarger

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Irv
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October 26, 2018 - 11:14 pm
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Hi damfino.  The pictured machine operates like steveduf’s.  In both, the string remains stationary and the bow rotates (and wobbles).  In the one I pictured, the bow remains stationary and the string (or wire) rotates around it.  Since the bow has camber, I think the latter method has considerable merit.

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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damfino
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October 27, 2018 - 9:22 am
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I didn't post the picture to imply one way has more merit than the other, since I've never done it, but just to show an example of what someone who's been making bows and violins for over 60 years put together for his work. 🙂 

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Irv
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October 27, 2018 - 10:29 am
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The joy on his face is evidence of his feeling of a successful design, and the size of the spool of wire attests to his experience.  I can make use of any and all photos, since it is fun to look at the myriad of solutions expended on a common problem.  I am sure that I can glean something from them all.

Research is what I’m doing when I don’t know what I’m doing.  —Werner von Braun

Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.         —Frank Zappa

Experience is a difficult teacher, it gives the test first and the lesson after.

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Fiddlerman
Fort Lauderdale
October 30, 2018 - 8:00 pm
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Irv said
..........Fiddlerman, once completed I am willing to send you a sample so you could compare the work of the machine to that of your luthiers.  What gauge wire do you like to work with (I assume about 26 gauge).  I did find a source of rose gold (over silver) plated wire.  Should be a looker.  

The guys have different gauges. I'll ask tomorrow. Thanks so much Irv.

"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."

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