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Can anyone tell me how this chart would continue?
Can anyone tell me how this chart would continue?
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TheMuffinMan
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January 31, 2020 - 9:48 pm
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How would this chart continue all the way down the finger board? I cannot figure out how to discern notes that would look identical from each other on the staff. 

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jnn2.....n.jpg?dl=0

 

I saw this site and it seems to infer that each note scale changes in each position and you follow the corresponding staff arrangement that they have shown for each string and that shifts in position by which notes are read can be identified by dots or lines on top of each other. But, that is not true, that only exists in their sheet music from what I have found. I would like to be able to clearly make out every note on the fingerboard when I look at sheet music. But, with all that is out on the web, I cannot get past the first seven rows of notes that go up to DAEB.

 

https://www.violinonline.com/f.....vanced.htm

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Peter
West Sussex, England UK
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February 1, 2020 - 10:22 am
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Hi,

The linked illustration may be what you're after:

https://routledgetextbooks.com.....gering.jpg

You could print it and add an illustration of the treble staff against it with the relationship of the notes on the staff to the fingerboard stop locations, if you wish. Just working out those things would be an education in itself.

However, if you are in your first few months of violin study and practice you may be advised to consolidate your experience a first position (as in your chart) before venturing too far up the fingerboard. At that time, you will feel ready and you will have enough musical experience to know where the notes are by ear. By all means, experiment with the sounds 'up there' now, but the patterns will become clearer and more obvious as time goes by. Violin has a very shallow learning curve, but the rewards are tremendous. A truly beautiful instrument.

Good luck, and keep on going.

If this all sounds like a mansplanation, then I apologise!

Peter

"It is vain to do with more that which can be done with less"  - William of Ockham

"A crown is merely a hat that lets the rain in" - Frederick the Great

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TheMuffinMan
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February 1, 2020 - 2:37 pm
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Yes, I am new. I am trying to learn to read music before I get into the violin first though and it is bugging me so much. Because the goal is to get through exercises and get to the point where I can print off anything I want in sheet music and go to the violin and know where exactly the sheet music is telling me to go. Obviously, with what is out there for information on how the chart would continue and noting the differences in, between notes that share the same annotations and then those with names is what I would have to figure out by ear. Having to replay the piece until I found it, unfortunately and then try and address whatever the change was in the sheet music that led into this note that is not in the first seven. 

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Peter
West Sussex, England UK
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February 1, 2020 - 3:40 pm
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<Disclosure> I'm not a music tutor, but I have experience:

Have you got your first violin yet, or access to any musical instrument? You will find that learning to read music without an instrument can be partially done by listening to recordings for which you have a score. Just follow the score as you listen; this will teach you not only where each note's pitch (frequency) occurs on the staff, but you'll also get a great introduction to timing and rhythm. You'll notice how fast or slow a piece runs as it is written, and how the whole / half / quarter / eight notes work. However, if you have a violin, guitar, keyboard etc, you can start to relate your own musical output to the notes on the staff. Violin is a odd one, because your fingers can choose to play notes between the 'normal notes', and that's where the fun begins. Hitting those notes each time, accurately and on time, is the essence of violin learning, and will take months to get okay, and years to get right. Watch some YouTube vids of violin virtuosi, and be in awe, but know that each and every one of us can approach that, given the time and effort.

Don't forget you have a voice. Teach yourself to sing violin or fiddle tunes (wordlessly, lah-lah, or whatever). If you are already an accomplished singer, then leverage that experience, and use it to learn written music.

Browse @Fiddlerman's videos. He has a friendly style, with lots of pro-tip additions, and he really knows his business. There are lots of violin tutorials on YouTube, but be critical, and don't be afraid to dismiss a channel if the presenter appears to be talking tosh; there are a few of them. If you can engage a one-to-one violin tutor, then do it. This person will watch you hold and play your violin, and will correct you before bad habits creep in.

But to answer your immediate concerns: don't worry about what you hear and read above the first seven or so semitones up each string. Get the far end of the fingerboard sorted; this will take several months, and will be highly rewarding because many of the most beautiful violin and fiddle tunes are there, at your fingertips, in the first position. Start with "Twinkle Twinkle", a tune based on a Mozart piece. Three months time, you can take on "Serenade" by Mozart, also without moving from first position, and in this case it's all in one octave, G-G. If you're into the fiddle side of the instrument, start out with slow ballads, and take on the reels and jigs when you are ready. Master these easier tunes, learn the simpler scales (G, D, C major) and get those fingers moving. Slow, then faster.

For what it's worth, I started violin from scratch four and a half months ago, and I still find myself in awe of those people playing fast and stylish on YouTube, and I may always do so. Violin will always challenge you, and that's part of the attraction: there will ever be something new to learn, something to improve. Go easy on yourself, there's a lot of work to do. Just promise me you'll enjoy it.

Blessings,

Peter

Peter

"It is vain to do with more that which can be done with less"  - William of Ockham

"A crown is merely a hat that lets the rain in" - Frederick the Great

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TheMuffinMan
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February 1, 2020 - 9:47 pm
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Yeah, thanks. I will get it figured out. Right now, I am 'decoding' single octave scale exercises from violinonline.com. They throw in a little spiral tune or arpeggio as it may be called at the end that goes through the beginning of a faster play style to spice things up. Practicing for now playing each key in the speed it is supposed to be at as if the violin was a piano moving up the scale. It is going well. I am just going to go through a bunch of exercises and then work up to an etude pretty soon. This one has a good build up structure to a familiarize one further with how notes build on the finger board. https://www.violinonline.com/etude1.html

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Peter
West Sussex, England UK
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February 2, 2020 - 2:08 am
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Good start.

Don't neglect the open strings as an exercise for your bowing; just hold the neck of the violin with your left hand and practice bowing.

Make each stroke of the bow do something useful. Short strokes, long ones, full-hair, on edge, light pressure, heavier pressure, at the frog, at the tip, at the middle, top half, bottom half, full bow. All these have a purpose. Make sure the bow is always at right-angles to the string, between the bridge and the end of the fingerboard, but experiment with sounds made as you approach these two extremes. Check out @Fiddlerman's video about holding the bow, and use a mirror to watch your technique.

Once you've got confidence with the bow, work on your left hand but never forget the importance of occasionally (and routinely) returning to bowing practice. When playing or exercising, alternate your attention between the two hands. Both are important.

Peter

"It is vain to do with more that which can be done with less"  - William of Ockham

"A crown is merely a hat that lets the rain in" - Frederick the Great

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Peter
West Sussex, England UK
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February 2, 2020 - 2:27 am
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Oh,

...and welcome to the forum.

This is a fantastic resource for fiddle folk of all ages, abilities and playing styles. There's lots of experience here to draw on, and it's all very friendly and helpful.

Peter

"It is vain to do with more that which can be done with less"  - William of Ockham

"A crown is merely a hat that lets the rain in" - Frederick the Great

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Fiddlerman
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February 5, 2020 - 8:26 am
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@TheMuffinMan - Welcome to the forum.

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