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I am a beginner with two lessons under my belt. My teacher has a family emergency so I am on my own for now. I am comparing a Holstein Pernambuco and a Holstein 1 star Pernambuco with my generic $160 carbon fiber bow. This is the best I can offer as far as testing and would appreciate your opinions. I've numbered the bows anonymously as 1,2,3. Thanks in advance. BtW it's a Markneukirchen violin, not magwhatever LOL.
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Unable to play it from either location. Are you sure it's a video mp4 file?
The old curmudgeon!
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My opinion is that to test bows you need to be experienced enough to know what you are testing them for. No disloyalty to Pierre, but stick with your generic carbon bow (at that price it should be OK for a rank beginner) and grow into it for a year or two. And hold on at least until your teacher is available again.
Andrew
Verified human - the ignominy!
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JohnG said
Unable to play it from either location. Are you sure it's a video mp4 file?
Not sure what happened. It is an mp4 video file but uploaded as a mp4 audio??
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Very hard to tell but I would say 3, 1, 2
"The richest person is not the one who has the most,
but the one who needs the least."
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I think 2,1 3. It seemed like #3 bounced a. it and seemed a little harder for you to control.
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Mouse said
I think 2,1 3. It seemed like #3 bounced a. it and seemed a little harder for you to control.
Not sure how much it matters but 1 is 61 grams, 2 is 62 grams and 3 is 60 grams.
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It varies per violinist. I prefer the heavier, some prefer the lighter weight bows. So, I I think weight does mayter per player.
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Mouse said
It varies per violinist. I prefer the heavier, some prefer the lighter weight bows. So, I I think weight does mayter per player.
Thanks Mouse, Fiddleeman and all. Number 1 was the no star pernambuco at 61 grams, 2 was the carbon fiber at 62 grams and 3 was the 1 star parnembuco at 60 grams. I agree that the 1 star was the most difficult to handle and required more concentration but I liked its sound and it was cleaner and easier to bounce (I realize something I don't need to worry about at this stage.) I like the no-star next but can see a little difference in that it is slightly harder to bounce, but slightly easier to bow, and my carbon fiber at 62 grams is the easiest to bow but the hardest to bounce and sounds slightly grittier on the string to me ... not bad ... just a little grittier and that may be because it has more rosin and has been played longer. I chatted with the shop and unfortunately they don't have a heavier 1 star b-stock. And I do realize bing a rank beginner that I dont "need" a wooden bow, just wanted one to use that didnt break the bank. I do like their sweeter sound. The journey continues.
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I don't know what your price-point is, and don't need to. I am just throwing these options out for you. Carbon fiber weave from Fiddlershop and hybrid from Fiddlershop. I believe the Hybrid is carbon inside and Pernambuco outside. I have both. I probably opened a whole can of worms. Like I said, it is pretty much what the violinist wants. What I prefer, may not be what you prefer, or what other forum members prefer.
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Looked like the 3rd bow was tightened more than the other 2.
At this stage in your playing, it's not going to matter which bow - as long as it feels comfortable to use.
If you practice, every day, you'll need to buy another bow or pay to have it re-haired by the end of a year, anyway - maybe sooner.
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Mouse said
I don't know what your price-point is, and don't need to. I am just throwing these options out for you. Carbon fiber weave from Fiddlershop and hybrid from Fiddlershop. I believe the Hybrid is carbon inside and Pernambuco outside. I have both. I probably opened a whole can of worms. Like I said, it is pretty much what the violinist wants. What I prefer, may not be what you prefer, or what other forum members prefer.
I had looked at the hybrid but didn't know if there was enough difference to justify being as I already had a carbon fiber. The 1 star b-stock is $259 so that's pretty much my limit as I've already lost $30 to the trial. I may take a second look at it. Thanks again. I think for the moment I'll pass on the hybrid.
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@SEHatfield 1 or 2 for me. whichever feels the best of those 2. and of the 3 pick the one that feels best. the one that is easiest for you to make sound. seems like you bounced more on the 3rd but it couldve just been that moment in time. at this point id probably be choosing the feel rather than sound.
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ABitRusty said
@SEHatfield 1 or 2 for me. whichever feels the best of those 2. and of the 3 pick the one that feels best. the one that is easiest for you to make sound. seems like you bounced more on the 3rd but it couldve just been that moment in time. at this point id probably be choosing the feel rather than sound.
Thanks. I'm leaning towards sending both back at this point. I liked the feel of the b-stock 1 star the best, my wife said it sounded the best, I tried to see if they had another b-stock 1 star that might be 61 or 62 grams but they did not. I had hoped that the heavier weight would help the control. At any rate, thanks for the advice.
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@SEHatfield bows from what ive experienced so far are even more personal than the violin. they both are but i think you can have recordings of violins and choose one easier than having a recording of a bow. That said ive bought a bow without testing it and been happy. it matched the descriptions i read about it. at least youve tried all three so not only do you know how it feels in hand playing but can hear how you sound with each. just trust what you feel now about them. it will most likely change as you progress but for now that judgement will work. youll find out more about what you like as you move forward in learning.
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Most bows are 60-62 grams, and control problems are less affected by absolute weight than they are by weight distribution - weight at the tip is much harder to control than weight at the frog. Balance them roughly in the middle on your finger and see which one has the centre of gravity closest to the frog - but there will probably be less than an inch in it. Otoh, this matters most when you are bowing at the frog, which you won't be doing for a while.
SEHatfield said my carbon fiber at 62 grams is the easiest to bow but the hardest to bounce and sounds slightly grittier on the string to me
You have to realise that, until your technique is developed, the sound comes from your technique, not from your gear. The technique for good tone is smooth constant bow motion always with sufficient pressure (from your right index finger) against the string for the bow speed, more speed, more pressure needed. Heavier beginner bows help with this (especially at the tip, so it's a double-edged sword - get yourself a pro bow with a light tip and you really will have to learn technique and not blame your gear). As you say, you won't need to bounce for a long time.
Andrew
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@SEHatfield I think any of the three will serve you starting out. What feels best to you right now would be the right choice for you.
BTW, noticed you've got what looks like a WAVE chinrest--I've been using the WAVE for I think about 2 years now, & I'm very happy with it.
Characterize people by their actions and you will never be fooled by their words.
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SharonC said
@SEHatfield I think any of the three will serve you starting out. What feels best to you right now would be the right choice for you.BTW, noticed you've got what looks like a WAVE chinrest--I've been using the WAVE for I think about 2 years now, & I'm very happy with it.
Yes indeed I'm using a Wave 2 1.5" and so far really like it. After going back and forth between them I'm kinda partial to the Holstein 1 star. I realize my technique is in its beginning phase but I can actually hear an ever so slight difference in it compared to the no-star and it feels better in the hand, not sure why. It's very different feeling/sounding than the carbon fiber. My video isn't the best example of the sounds. We'll see.
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I've decided to return both the Holstein bows for now. I want my technique to improve a little more, want to have a teacher to bounce bow choice off of (mine is dealing with an extended family issue), and I want to explore how far my current violin will get me (understanding that it is said you match the bow to the violin and not vise versa). I appreciate all of the comments and advice.
Steve
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