Welcome to our forum. A Message To Our New and Prospective Members . Check out our Forum Rules. Lets keep this forum an enjoyable place to visit.

Check out our 2023 Group Christmas Project HERE

AAA
Avatar
Please consider registering
guest
sp_LogInOut Log Insp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope




Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed Topic RSSsp_TopicIcon
Cross Tuning on the Fiddle
Origins
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (39 votes) 
Avatar
ELCBK
USA
Members

Regulars
August 24, 2023 - 7:31 pm
Member Since: June 10, 2020
Forum Posts: 7644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
101sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

@Strabo -

I'm curious, how are you thinking about these tunes? 

Are you playing AEAE for tunes that are normally played on only the A & E - so playing the tune regular & then lower? 

Are you playing ADAE for tunes that are normally played on D & A, then using the lower A & the E for droning? 

...or something different?

Avatar
stringy
Members

Regulars
August 24, 2023 - 7:50 pm
Member Since: August 23, 2020
Forum Posts: 1964
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
102sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

Here's a great display of cross tuning playing on the fiddle, This may have been posted before, even by me, and even on this thread lol but here it is again anyway.

Avatar
ABitRusty
Members

Regulars
August 24, 2023 - 8:31 pm
Member Since: February 9, 2019
Forum Posts: 3845
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
103sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

"- My brain is clearly unable to manage the conflict between written notes (in GDAE) and a fiddle tuned otherwise. So I must rely upon my ear -- not a bad thing!"

Strabo

  

HAHA... YEAH I tried the same thing in a couple of tunes and ran into the same.  

I know Ive mentioned it on the forum but not sure in reply to you... Rayna Gelert has a great webpage with alot of free play by ear..no talking or any dots..cross tuned fiddle tunes in the manner that she plays them.   Has a fast, medium, slow, and i think speed adjustment built in.   You should check it out if your fiddlin' with cross tuning.

Avatar
Strabo
Members

Regulars
August 25, 2023 - 4:40 pm
Member Since: October 4, 2021
Forum Posts: 138
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
104sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

ELCBK  There are some A tunes that can be mostly played on the top pair of strings and then mirrored on the bottom pair, (e.g.Cripple Creek). But those are more the exception than the rule, and that is not what I’m looking for.

I’m trying to play the music as naturally and fully as I can, taking advantage of accessible double-stops, drones and open-string resonances that can enrich the  relationships among the notes and the overall sound. An example is Happy Hollow, which is played on the bottom three strings. It is necessary to make some fingering adjustments on the bottom strings, but they come easily with a little practice. If I inadvertently revert to the old GDAE patterns it is very obvious -- it sounds bad so it is easily corrected the next time through.

D tunes are even easier. In ADAE there is only one string raised. One of my current favs is Sal's Got Mud Between Her Toes, with notes ranging from high A on the top string in the B part to low A on the open bottom string in the C part. (All in first position, of course!) 

I hope this makes sense and is responsive to your question, Emily. I tried to upload the scores for these two tunes, but I’m not at all sure I got the technology right. In any event, I do NOT use the written music for cross tuned music as that could cause serious and potentially irreversible brain damage, haha.

And Stringy, that’s a great video. Specker is truly amazing, a very intense guy. I do believe he has his voltage turned up to 11...

Strabo

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
ABitRusty
Members

Regulars
August 25, 2023 - 5:33 pm
Member Since: February 9, 2019
Forum Posts: 3845
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

My favorite recording of Sals Got Mud... is by the Gilded Bats string band..also the wayfarers as a set with angeline the baker.   Great tune!  one thats been on the list but never seriously tried to learn.

Avatar
ELCBK
USA
Members

Regulars
August 25, 2023 - 9:26 pm
Member Since: June 10, 2020
Forum Posts: 7644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
106sp_Permalink sp_Print
0

@Strabo -

Thanks - yes, I understand.  I haven't had any trouble lowering just ONE string (lowest), especially after played through a few times, so I'd probably be okay if I only lowered my E string, like for some cajun tunes   🤔... I think I'd have severe problems if I had to change my lowest AND my highest string, though. 

Yeah, I'd forget about the dots & just watch someone play - at least I see there are YT tutorials available (if anyone else is interested)! 

Stick with it - I think it will will become second nature to you before you know it! 

...think getting the shuffle bowing down helps.

Avatar
Strabo
Members

Regulars
August 27, 2023 - 9:58 am
Member Since: October 4, 2021
Forum Posts: 138
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
107sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

Stringy, Sal’s Got Mud is actually quite an easy tune, at least it was for me. I learned it from this video:  

 And moving from GDAE to ADAE was a simple switch, affecting only the lowest notes of the C part. That also makes it good training to build fluency with the raised bottom string. And it is fun to play, with the middle high and low A B C parts. I like hearing and feeling the low-to-high range of the fiddle (even though I’m just a first position player). 

And your are  correct, Emily: shuffle bowing enlivens everything and does a nice job of drawing attention away from my mistakes, haha!

An interesting aspect to all of this is that I wonder if I am committing myself to always playing D tunes in ADAE and never in standard. The retuning itself is not an issue, but I fear that my brain and muscle memory might not be able to handle playing the same tune both ways -- it could be terminally confusing!

On the other hand, I can move seamlessly between English and Spanish without thinking, so maybe I’ll surprise myself.

Anyway, it is good that Fiddling is not a Life & Death endeavor...

Avatar
ABitRusty
Members

Regulars
August 27, 2023 - 10:22 am
Member Since: February 9, 2019
Forum Posts: 3845
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
108sp_Permalink sp_Print
5

Ive got that version in my playlists too @Strabo!  Another good one, if not even better.   It for sure is for the view.  

I guess the muscle memory thing with learning a tune in cross vs standard is a point.  BUT.. if you play the tune you play it so why switch?   It would just be the hassel of retuning and you already know thats gonna happen for the banjos so its probably not as big a deal as it may seem.

Avatar
ELCBK
USA
Members

Regulars
January 24, 2024 - 11:48 am
Member Since: June 10, 2020
Forum Posts: 7644
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Here is a link to an extensive list of fiddle cross TUNING videos (from Best Music Tools) - made for tuning your strings. 

Fiddle Tuner - Cross Tuning playlist 

This is the only one where all strings are tuned down.

 

Really could use some advice as to how helpful any of these are.

My concern is even though they are recorded on a fiddle, the description says "12TET" - so, equal temperament, not 5ths... so isn't this kinda counterproductive for doublestops using any open strings? 

I had meant to share these a while back, then hesitated because even though I like tuning down - don't know if I'm being too picky. 

When most folks change tuning, don't they just tweak it by ear anyway? 

So, would some of these tuning videos be considered a good place to start cross tuning?

Forum Timezone: America/New_York
Most Users Ever Online: 696
Currently Online: AndrewH
Guest(s) 44
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today AndrewAllanRoberts
Upcoming Watchtower68, Muja, terezka, RonP, JochSejo, Ivanorcan, Looby, Frank Howard, Nick, kay88, RCall, Kmmoon, StaceyC, Leigh, RSorderfans, GiovanniWhite
Top Posters:
ELCBK: 7644
ABitRusty: 3845
Mad_Wed: 2849
Barry: 2690
Fiddlestix: 2647
Oliver: 2439
Gordon Shumway: 2417
DanielB: 2379
Mark: 2136
damfino: 2113
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 3
Members: 31651
Moderators: 0
Admins: 7
Forum Stats:
Groups: 16
Forums: 81
Topics: 10564
Posts: 133881
Newest Members:
mariachi, avagrey92, Alison, David, boredmeddlesome, KennethPearce, alexreynolds, soophiemartin84, LateBeginner, Marianne
Administrators: Fiddlerman: 16422, KindaScratchy: 1760, coolpinkone: 4180, BillyG: 3744, MrsFiddlerman: 2, Jimmie Bjorling: 0, Mouse: 5255