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Learning other instruments
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (1 votes) 
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Andrew Fryer
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November 1, 2018 - 4:52 am
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Fiddlerman said
there is something to be said for sticking to one instrument.

Certainly sticking to something is important.

At school we were expected to know at least two instruments, so I was piano and oboe, and my best friend was piano, violin and clarinet. I tried another friend's cello once - that seemed like an easy instrument. Life would not have been so good if I had given up either piano or oboe. But I gave them both up after university. That was a mistake, although pianos require premises. I guess I should have dated a violinist in 1981. That would have set me on the right track!

I always wanted to be a juvenile delinquent but my parents wouldn't let me.

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Demoiselle
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tiffanyroseviolin said
Only learned violin, never think to learn other instruments, so don't know... But you should learn from the right hand....   

I'm not learning from the right hand, I'm teaching my right hand and slap it every day because its so awfully stupid. My left hand gets all the sugar because it's so agile.

bananaparty

My violin is a 3/4 violin, made for right-handed players, though I play it left-handed. As I felt she was the best in the shop of all 3/4 violins I tried and the luthier agreed. I prefer Obligato strings together with Eudoxa E string.

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Andrew Fryer
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I'm happy with my RH. My left hand is the one that needs the work.

I always wanted to be a juvenile delinquent but my parents wouldn't let me.

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pchoppin
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Fiddlerman said
I kind of believe that learning to play an instrument in many ways is like learning a new language. The more you learn the easier it is to learn a new one.
That being said, there is something to be said for sticking to one instrument. 🙂  

@Fiddlerman 

The language is music.  That is how you are getting this sense of learning multiple languages.  It is through the music itself, which engages the same areas of the brain which language uses.  I speak French fluently and I can relate to your experience with learning multiple instruments in much the same way. 

I played percussion, and only percussion, for over 25 years.  I never attempted another instrument because I felt much like you, that I had to stick with one instrument, or group of instruments (percussion).  I had the very false impression that I could not branch out to other instruments.  That somehow I was locked into the one instrument I was playing.  

After having begun violin this year I have discovered that my potential in music has been more than I had believed it was for most of my life and I had placed on myself limitations.  

It’s not about 1 or 2 or 3 instruments.  It’s about music, and what you want to do with it. Who knows, there may be other instruments I am capable of learning.  I would not want to place limits on my own potential. 

(By the way, I have always wanted to conduct an orchestra. I bet I could do that too)

- Pete -

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Andrew Fryer
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There are some generalisations going on here, and I am not romantic about languages any longer.

Unless you are a virtuoso, or you have a photographic memory, you have to take into account how much time all these things will take.

People react to languages differently - for some the grammar is the beast. For me it's the vocab. I have known since I was a teenager that I have memory difficulties. I speak German fluently and I read about 10 other languages, and every language I learn is just as painful as the last. But I was addicted to starting new languages although I have no "talent" for it. As a young kid I was fascinated by it and it became my adult hobby. I now feel too old for it and want to quit.

The only language I've done calculations on is French. By the time I had read Proust for a second time I calculated that I had been learning it for 15 years for about 2 hours per day, "memorising" 30 words per day. That would be 10,000 words a year, and that would be 150,000 words after 15 years, but of course my long-term retention was maybe 15% of everything I "learnt". Curiously, and coincidentally, 2 hours a day for 15 years is the proverbial 10,000 hours.

But  some people memorise vocab and never forget it. They are lucky. And some people are musical virtuosi. Those of us who aren't should probably stick with one thing. Sometimes arguing that it's nice to be a jack of all trades is just denial.

Sorry if that is a bit heavy for this forum!

I always wanted to be a juvenile delinquent but my parents wouldn't let me.

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Andrew Fryer
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Andrew Fryer said
I have a friend who works in Dawkes music, and, as far as I can see, they are the cheapest supplier of flutes in Britain, AND he can get me a staff discount! On Tuesday I asked him to get me a Yamaha YFL-272 and he said "No, you've got enough on your plate." He's right, but how frustrating is that!  

Last night I met a woman I hadn't seen for a long time, and she is still having her eternal clear-out, and she said she had some violin music and I'd be a good home for it, and I said, "I'd be a very good home for your tenor banjo," and she replied, "No, you've got enough on your plate!"

dazed

I always wanted to be a juvenile delinquent but my parents wouldn't let me.

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CharlieStrings
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@pchoppin @Fiddlerman 

I like the analogy of learning music to learning languages.  I decided to learn some French for an upcoming trip to France and the study has got me pining to return to Spanish which I struggled with for years in school.

I think it's a matter of knowing what our goals are.  With French, I'd just like to speak enough travel French to get by while we are in France, but learning Spanish has been a long term endeavor that I would ultimately like to read, speak and converse fluently.

Similarly, I believe that violin will be my long term commitment, maybe one day orchestral strings, definitely some blues and improv.  Guitar is a struggle playing right handed, but I enjoy the sound and the rhythm.  My guitar teacher is an excellent theory instructor too.  So I think I'll stick with some guitar but concentrate on violin - as my guitar teacher says "It's all music."

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Demoiselle
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Andrew Fryer said
There are some generalisations going on here, and I am not romantic about languages any longer.

Unless you are a virtuoso, or you have a photographic memory, you have to take into account how much time all these things will take.

People react to languages differently - for some the grammar is the beast. For me it's the vocab. I have known since I was a teenager that I have memory difficulties. I speak German fluently and I read about 10 other languages, and every language I learn is just as painful as the last. But I was addicted to starting new languages although I have no "talent" for it. As a young kid I was fascinated by it and it became my adult hobby. I now feel too old for it and want to quit.

The only language I've done calculations on is French. By the time I had read Proust for a second time I calculated that I had been learning it for 15 years for about 2 hours per day, "memorising" 30 words per day. That would be 10,000 words a year, and that would be 150,000 words after 15 years, but of course my long-term retention was maybe 15% of everything I "learnt". Curiously, and coincidentally, 2 hours a day for 15 years is the proverbial 10,000 hours.

But  some people memorise vocab and never forget it. They are lucky. And some people are musical virtuosi. Those of us who aren't should probably stick with one thing. Sometimes arguing that it's nice to be a jack of all trades is just denial.

Sorry if that is a bit heavy for this forum!  

Andrew, it looks like we share a similar problem. I know I have to play and play and play...... to teach the geography of the violin fingerboard to my stupid fingers. If other people need to play a scale a hundred times, I have to play it about 10 thousand times. In many other issues I benefited from all those many repetitions. Because in the end it looked like I was firmer than average people.

I know I wouldn't have a chance if I tried to learn violin the classical way, with etudes on sheets. I would fall asleep over repeating that over and over again.

I am German and I improved my English via......

  1. Watching many DVDs with my favorite movies
  2. Listening to a U.S. political radio talk station all day (for at least 3 years that station ran without interruption until I went to bed)
  3. Refusing to speak German as much as possible for 5 years (felt like going out abroad)
  4. Reading English texts loudly
  5. Joining the fight for Obama's reelection in 2011, debating on Twitter and political blogs.

Still my English is not as perfect as my German mother tongue, but at times I met Americans here in Berlin who assumed me to be a fellow American.

It is extremely hard for me to learn a language or a new instrument, but I find ways to make it a fun thing and not boring at all. So I can repeat and repeat without getting tired.

My violin is a 3/4 violin, made for right-handed players, though I play it left-handed. As I felt she was the best in the shop of all 3/4 violins I tried and the luthier agreed. I prefer Obligato strings together with Eudoxa E string.

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Demoiselle
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November 8, 2018 - 2:06 pm
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Andrew Fryer said
I'm happy with my RH. My left hand is the one that needs the work.  

Once left-handed people were punished and slapped, simply discriminated a lot. Thanks God times are different now. I was a little sarcastic after reading something that seemed to sound like age-old discrimination of left-handed people.

If your brain is 'wired' to be right-handed you cannot train your left hand to become as good as your right hand. You can improve your left hand but there will always be a difference. Science today is able to look into the brain and see why somebody has a certain preference. So it's not a good idea to try to change someone from left-handed to right-handed. People who show ugly handwriting were retrained left-handers in school in may cases. Experienced school teachers can see that if they see a hand-writing: "Aha, this person is left-handed and was trained to write with the right hand."

My violin is a 3/4 violin, made for right-handed players, though I play it left-handed. As I felt she was the best in the shop of all 3/4 violins I tried and the luthier agreed. I prefer Obligato strings together with Eudoxa E string.

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Andrew Fryer
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A German once asked me if I was Dutch. That was nice.

My left hand (and foot) is the one with the arthritis. But I've played piano and oboe, so I'm sure I can train my left hand eventually. Maybe I'll get 10 years of pleasure before I'm decrepit

I always wanted to be a juvenile delinquent but my parents wouldn't let me.

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Demoiselle
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Andrew Fryer said
A German once asked me if I was Dutch. That was nice.

My left hand (and foot) is the one with the arthritis. But I've played piano and oboe, so I'm sure I can train my left hand eventually. Maybe I'll get 10 years of pleasure before I'm decrepit  

If a German is used to American English, U.K. English may seem to sound kinda Dutch. Dutch and English have some resemblance in things speech melody. Although the vocabulary Dutch is actually a variation of Deutsch (in Low German Dütsch). In fact the Netherlands have been part of the Holy Roman Empire in the middle ages. But if you consider the Dutch language sort of medieval German, it is certainly closer to British English than modern German. Like today's Friesian Low German is very close to British English too.

Concerning measures to improve my English I forgot....

  • Joining ACB, American Church in Berlin, becoming a pretty active member

I certainly train my right hand, its fingerboard is awfully hard. But it will never be able to do what my  left hand is able too. Above all in things feeling and expression my right hand is not the right candidate for bowing. It could do that, but the quality in expression would be lower.

My violin is a 3/4 violin, made for right-handed players, though I play it left-handed. As I felt she was the best in the shop of all 3/4 violins I tried and the luthier agreed. I prefer Obligato strings together with Eudoxa E string.

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markcobb
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November 15, 2018 - 1:55 am
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RockingLR33 said
I find it really funny when people say "don't go for this degree go for that one it'll be better for you" but I know SO many people who have never been able to get a job in their chosen fields. even those with PHD's. So in the end do what you're happy with and what you won't regret (hopefully) in the future.  

It's apart of the "crab bucket effect" If a crab is in a bucket alone, he can escape. However, if he is in a bucket with other crabs, the other crabs will keep pulling him down. Society works the same, usually, but not always, on a subconscious level. People subconsciously don't want others to advance or change their lives because it makes them look worse by comparison. For example, when a person says he wants to go to the gym, and those around him say, "why, you look fine.", because on a subconscious level it will make them look worse.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crab_mentality

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