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@Gordon Shumway -
There's other ways to prevent your hand from creeping up the stick or thumb slipping through the bow.
I believe it depends on your anatomy to figure out what works - in my case, I only needed to extend the thumb leather closer to the frog & thicken it by a couple wraps of cloth tape.
Now, when my bow hair tightened to the right tension, just the very edge of my thumb touches the stick between the frog and the thumb pad - my problem was completely solved.
...I don't have to worry about the edge of my thumb nail scratching any wood, with a CF bow - so my thumb is secure and NO tension in my fingers or hand.
I think most people benefit from a thicker thumb wrap.
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If you can't hold your bow comfortably, you'll end up with tension & terrible sound!
Always a pertinent topic - wanted to add this GREAT video by Lora (Red Desert Violin) & remind people there are easy things you can add to your bows to make them MORE COMFORTABLE!
MANY professional Violinists, Violist & Cellists are adding comfort factors to their bows!
From Quantumbasscenter.com:
Adding a soft piece of high-friction material, such as rubber, to the contact area allows for holding the bow with less pressure, resulting in a more relaxed hand that’s more available for fine motor control. The slightly larger diameter of the grip is not only easier to hold securely in position, but the higher-friction material also helps to prevent the thumb and fingers from slipping.
Fiddlershop carries the "D'Addario Bowmaster Bow Grip", in a few sizes - it slips over the stick.
"Stringvision Bowgrip", is a high-tech grippy frog & thumb pad cover with a perfect indentation for your thumb! Cellists were raving about this at the Fiddle Hell Festival, but there are also Violin & Viola versions.
"Viotech Suregrips" are a pair of slip-on, foam, thumb pad covers - online everywhere, made in the UK.
Top Violinists often use a flexible piece of rubber or medical grade tubing (beware of latex allergy) - some, like Lora in the video, use stretchy pen/pencil grip tubes of rubber, foam or squishy Gel!
Nan Kemberling has EXCELLENT DIY instructions for using pencil grips and talks about bow grip comfort!
← If you have any arthritis, consider the "EGO APPLE" pencil grip!
You can customize it by cutting a little slit so it will set a little over the frog if you need it.
- Emily
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Or a simple habit to get into may be to adjust your grip every time there's a rest in the music.
Andrew
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@Gordon Shumway -
Why would you want to deal with that when there's so many more important things to focus on while playing?
...simple fixes can make life so much more pleasant!
They don't prevent you from adjusting your grip when needed and I've seen these recommendations used by professionals - they work.
🤔 ...most of the music I play doesn't have any rests.
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Gordon Shumway said
Your hand will only stop slipping up the bow if you stay aware of it and correct it whenever you detect it.
I still haven't mastered slippage-prevention, but I have noticed a few things.
Detecting it is best done with the thumb, in case it wasn't obvious.
Arguably the thumb is your most important digit on the right hand. Sure, index-finger pressure is crucial, but that is very easily learnt. My index finger, however, can't detect when it has slipped over the leather and then over the silver winding, but my thumb is very sensitive to its position between the leather and the wood of the frog. Ultimately, I suspect the thumb will play a much greater role in my bow grip.
My teacher taught me a useful exercise - hold the bow in the middle vertically, frog downwards, in your right hand between all 5 finger tips. Then "climb down" the bow, i.e. make the bow rise until you have a correct bow hold. Don't touch it with the left hand.
Andrew
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@Gordon Shumway -
IMHO it's not worth spending more time on it - especially if you've been dealing with this issue for a few years.
Everyone's hand and finger shapes are different and there are also changes as we age. I had trouble with my hand migrating up the stick - my constant attempts to correct & keep a grip was causing tension in my hand & fingers.
Found I don't need the whole thumb pad thick - this simple mod allows me to freely move my fingers, with NO TENSION & NO SLIPPING.
I filed a little bevel on the edge of the frog where my thumb rests (Codabows don't need this) and then added a small wrapping of black duck tape
This is in NO WAY cheating. I've looked closely & have seen plenty of professional violinists that use a thicker thumb pad.
Suggest figuring out what your hand & fingers need, take a minute to try something simple that could help - this made a HUGE, VERY ENJOYABLE, difference for me!
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Anyone attempting to correct their bow grip, keep it from slipping, or just new to using a bow?
Here's a very simple aid that can help you start off right!
Bow "Seat Belt"! (The Orchestra Teacher)
Just having something novel for your fingers to touch, like this - can draw attention to it, remind your brain to focus on your grip.
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That video is a GREAT tip. Although Thomas is bowing great and he is used to his new bow hold, his ring finger is constantly lifting from the bow. Thank you @ELCBK
Jim(Thomases Dad)
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@JimandThomas -
If you try it - let us know if it helps. 😊
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@ELCBK We are trying it after school today. I certainly will let you know. I think it is a great tip
Jim(Thomases Dad)
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@ELCBK This is really interesting. I find that using the rubberband makes me more aware of my other fingers (not just the ring finger), and what they are doing on the bow real time as I’m playing. This tip is a great find!
Characterize people by their actions and you will never be fooled by their words.
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I just tried the rubber band. Putting your ring finger under it is a horrible idea!
Andrew
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@Gordon Shumway -
I don't think you have to put your finger under the rubber band to benefit from just feeling the rubber band on the frog.
...finger under might be more appropriate for children with smaller fingers.
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@ELCBK We are LOVING the rubber band trick, although he doesn't want to do it in front of anyone, it made a HUGE difference. I will take a video today and post tonight to sho you
Jim(Thomases Dad)
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Gordon Shumway said
Although I do not recommend Simon Fischer to beginners (1000+ pages), I have not got rid of his books yet. I was sorting out the bookmarks in them and I came across The Violin Lesson, p. 43, where he pretends that he is offering advice on how to prevent your hand from slipping up the bow. His advice really doesn't work. Your hand will only stop slipping up the bow if you stay aware of it and correct it whenever you detect it.But it is interesting that he writes of the first finger that you should NEVER use the Russian hold (which he, like Bushkova, calls "the old Auer hold"). This is likely to be good advice, but you must also remain aware that it is possible that Fischer is just too pedantic at times.
Recently I have come to suspect that my problem is having my right index finger too far along the silver winding - this forces the thumb to come up to meet it. Some are able to stretch the index finger out like this, but perhaps they simply have longer fingers than me. So I am currently finding it easier to have the index finger half on the silver winding and half on the leather.
Andrew
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