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Chord Progressions for Improv
Useful to learn.
Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 Topic Rating: 5 (27 votes) 
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ELCBK
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May 26, 2022 - 3:37 pm
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@Gordon Shumway -

I knew you had a better memory than you let on! 😊 

...mine is OVERLOADED. 😳😁  

 

@ABitRusty -

THAT is really an EXCELLENT video!  

I LOVE how Rick explains everything & it's super nice he pointed out what chords & the progression for one of MY FAVORITE Pink Floyd tunes! 

 

I'll catch the 'Sus Chord' ball the video threw at me to mention more - cause I think they are pretty interesting Chords. 

From Banjos Go Great With The Fiddle Thread, pg 3 , post #51 - I said: 

Sus Chords have NO 3rd, unlike a Major or Minor Chord - it's usually replaced with the 2nd or 4th, making it UNSTABLE  So, it's "suspended between Major & Minor" - wanting to cause movement toward a stable chord of one or the other! 

Major Chord (Triad) = Tonic (1st), 3rd, 5th. 

Sus2 Chord = Tonic, 2nd, 5th. 

Sus4 Chord = Tonic, 4th, 5th.

I think Sus Chords can FUNCTION in a similar way to the Leading Tone of a scale (the 7th) - or maybe even ANY note, that precedes another by only a Half Step.  There's just a stronger pull with a Sus Chord than a single note, because of TENSION caused by internal dissonance.  Sus2 Chords have less dissonance, less tension, so are weaker than Sus4 Chords.

The Sus4 can have an enhanced effect if used as a replacement for a Dominant Chord (V) in a Chord Progression!  The Sus4 Chord resolves directly to the Tonic Chord (cause there's no Dominant Chord).  The Sus4 becomes a Subdominant Chord, and the move from Subdominant to Tonic becomes a PLAGAL CADENCE ("Amen")! 

Not ready for more on Cadence, but this leads me back to: Posts #12 & #15 - FUNCTIONAL HARMONY, Chord FUNCTIONS, SUBDOMINANT & DOMINANT Chords! 

 

Predominants & Subdominants

Predominant: is like IV - when it goes to resolve at V (the dominant). 

Subdominant: is like IV - when it skips V & goes to resolve at the Tonic Chord.  

What Is A Sus Chord? - The Acoustic Guitarist

Understanding chord construction is key to understanding music... Sus chords... can be used to build anticipation simply by delaying the resolution to the anticipated major or minor chord or to add spice to, what might be, an otherwise bland chord progression.
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Gordon Shumway
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May 26, 2022 - 4:28 pm
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5

ELCBK said
memory ...

...mine is OVERLOADED. 😳😁 

It's possible. Sometimes you've got to stop and smell the roses.

dazed

Andrew

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ELCBK
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May 26, 2022 - 4:48 pm
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@Gordon Shumway -

I have been, every day when I pick up my Viola (Edgar) - but it's been Daffodils & Lilacs! 

Keep up!

 

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ELCBK
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May 26, 2022 - 5:00 pm
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MY, OH MY, Gavin Leeper caught my eye! 
 

💥 Secondary Dominants! 

💥 Tritone Substitution! 

💥 Backdoor ii-V's! 

💥 MODULATION! 

 

...COOL CHORD PROGRESSIONS used in Japanese Contemporary Music! 

 

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ABitRusty
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May 27, 2022 - 1:01 am
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@elcbk another timely Adam Neely video! 😆   youll get a kick out of this

I did learn from the video that the i64 type stuff is called figured bass notation.  you may be interested in the video...idk.  relevant to discussion though.

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ELCBK
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May 27, 2022 - 12:39 pm
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@ABitRusty -

That's funny.  I saw that video while I was poking around yesterday, thinking it wouldn't be relevant - of course I was WRONG!

FABULOUS video - very helpful! 

THANK YOU! 

https://www.lovethispic.com/uploaded_images/308634-Music-Is-The-Voice-Of-The-Soul.jpg

 

My final take on this thread:

It's made me realize I only think I fall in love with melodies, but in reality many of the melodies I love have NO meaning to me without some harmony.  

My long term goal is to be able to play more enjoyable music without any backup, amp, etc... just the instrument in my hands. 

Whether playing by myself, jamming or backup, I believe I'll eventually become a better all around fiddler because of learning how to apply music theory.

...this is already helping me learn what to listen for and interpret more of what I hear.

- Emily

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ABitRusty
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May 27, 2022 - 7:29 pm
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i agree.. you find and post some great stuff.  very well laid out and i appreciate the time you spend on them.  sometimes you make my brain hurt though...so theres that 🤪😁

DONT stop adding.

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ELCBK
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May 28, 2022 - 1:06 pm
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@ABitRusty -

Thanks for the encouragement! 

And thank YOU for helping me learn more about music - you always point me in GREAT directions. 

Thanx for this video - GREAT Tutorial & tips!   Shows how easy it can be to use Music Theory for composing with software - the essential elements; Tonic/Root, chords, Chord Progression & melody! 

 

 

Hope others will see the relevance of THIS video you shared in another Thread

 

This video shows not only the role of Chord Progressions in a composition, but consider the other elements layered when thinking of backing and ALSO for using in improv, - think outside the box! 

I can see replacing a series of notes, in a solo or backing, with bowed sound effects - chops, harmonics, sul ponticello, soft trills - above or below the octave the tune centers on, etc...  

We've already talked about chord droning in many threads, which is related - can be an added layer of harmony in small or large sections.  Knowing Chord Progressions, again, important! 

 

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/3dohnewcsOc/maxresdefault.jpg

AND, there's nothing worse - than a Chord Progression with a chord that isn't changed at the right time! 

...but that's another topic.

- Emily

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ABitRusty
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July 25, 2022 - 2:08 pm
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not really aimed at violin but a neat video demonstrating how different chord progressions can sound on same melody line.

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ELCBK
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July 25, 2022 - 5:56 pm
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@ABitRusty -

Outstanding video for this thread! 

Now, I start looking at this like it opens up a whole new world of notes I could noodle around with if I was playing along with a plain/simple melody! 

EXACTLY what I've been looking for! 

Thank you!

 

Also... recently been looking at Symmetric Scales because they have more than one root.  I'm only really interested in the Diminished (also an Octatonic Scale) & Augmented Scales and how best to use them.

The symmetric scales are rarely used for whole melodies or prolonged periods of improvising, because their regular intervals do not fit well with the Major scale or with any of the minor scales.

However, they can be effective when improvising for adding brief passages of tension. They also play a useful role for improvising over a key change, since they can partially fit with two different Major or minor scales at the same time. 

- Emily

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ABitRusty
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July 25, 2022 - 6:06 pm
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glad it was a useful share.   He has great content! 

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ELCBK
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Oops, had to edit my previous thread. 

Not trying to get off topic, but just realized the Diminished Scale is also an Octatonic Scale!

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ELCBK
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September 29, 2022 - 11:57 pm
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THIS IS SO COOL! 

Adam Neely participated in an experiment to determine if the brains, of jazz improvisation musicians, process harmony differently - they used chord progressions to test for this! 

 

 

Ah, if only to understand music this well... dreaming. 

https://cdn.wallpapersafari.com/27/8/zl92HK.jpg

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ELCBK
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"Melodic Chord Progressions - The Most Forgotten Technique" (Learning Music Skills) 

 

 

00:00 - Intro  

00:27 - Comparing two progressions  

00:55 - How to listen to chord progressions  

01:28 - Example of which chord tones are most important melodically  

02:22 - Adjusting a progression to make it more melodic & interesting  

04:10 - The beginning and final result compared  

04:50 - When and why do you apply this melody technique?

 

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/2a/c4/47/2ac447556ccbbbda8733c4fb878eb99f.jpg

- Emily 

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ABitRusty
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another great share @elcbk.  I think some of it depends on the type of music one is backing and how many other backing instruments.   you wouldnt want everyone to get too busy with chord interpretations...it would get muddy and mess with the melody so not sure if always ..but thats probably a personal prefrence. 

Just thinking if a group has a piano another guitar and a bass, somebody probably needs to be sticking closer to his first example.  In a duet type setting for Irish,  I prefer what Dennis Cahill would have done with chords as opposed to a driving fast type style.  both are cool ways to do it and something to strive for though if learning backing.  Its probably a good idea to learn as much as possible though and the jest of what he is saying.  Just thoughts though and like I said a personal preference in what I like to listen to.

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ELCBK
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October 4, 2022 - 1:34 pm
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https://art.ebsqart.com/Art/Gallery/Media-Style/787671/650/650/BLACKCATMISCHIEFTEXT.jpg@ABitRusty -

Definitely see your point when it comes to playing along with more than 2 musicians - and I think the music style and melody should dictate what will work best, like in the case of Hayes & Cahill.

It's not hard for me to think along the lines of the video, probably because my whole musical perspective on backing is so limited - a few extra notes is just a little improv to me. 

Thanks to early piano lessons overshadowing everything 🙄, memories linger of 'left hand'/bass clef area and 'right hand'/treble clef area - with occasional intimate interplay & role reversal.  So, for my 5-string instruments, I still see each chord as potentially extended & arpeggiated, but I like the variety of a choice double-stop that doesn't always include the root... the thought of seeding harmony with the tension of dissonance is also alluring.  Extra notes in the bassline, that enhance or counter the melody, is just icing on the cake - but the dynamics are important (some expression should be hinted, not blurted out). 

🤔 Sorry, I'm off in La La Land - you know I don't actually 'back' anyone... this process is still all just inside my head. 

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/26/7a/f2/267af202c4e12f46f9c9801d6e083c4c.jpg

 

"Mischief"

...one of my old favorites that works - even though there's a lot going on.

- Emily

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ELCBK
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🙄 Geez, think I should've started the thread topic off with this video... 

 

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